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Tecumseh Snow King 8HP - Won't Start.


viennatech's Avatar
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12-15-08, 01:33 PM   #1  
Tecumseh Snow King 8HP - Won't Start.

I am the recipient of an older snow blower equipped with a tecumseh HMSK80 (8 HP Snow King Engine). The previous owner tells me that it needed something to keep it running. He was not familiar with what so he bought an entirely new snowblower. I figured since the price was right (free) I could get this thing running with time and TLC.

The engine has electric start which turns over and there is compression heard. No start. I pulled the spark plug and it was wet with fuel but quite old and nasty. So I replaced with a new plug.

I drained all the fuel from the tank and lines and put in fresh fuel. I also drained the "sludge" that was formerly oil and replaced it anew.

I can get the engine to crank but it will not fire at all. There is spark (As tested with a spark tester) and there seems to be plenty of fuel as the plug remains wet, if i crank it long enough some white puffs will come out of the muffler which I assume to be raw fuel, but it never even indicates "trying" to start. Almost as if there was no ignition at all.

So where to? It appears that carb rebuild is the main thing done with these engines but that was generally for a no fuel situation, it almost seems I have too much fuel.

Ideas?

Thanks!!

 
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Airman's Avatar
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12-15-08, 03:17 PM   #2  
There are other numbers on your engine that will help further identify your engine and components. Just after the model number should be a Spec. No. and D.O.M. Post those if you would and I can determine more about your engine.

Is the carburetor the adjustable type? Does it have idle and main adjustment screws?

Here is a link to a service manual for your engine. Take a look in the carburetor section and identify the type (series) carburetor installed.
http://www.cpdonline.com/692509.pdf

 
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12-15-08, 03:54 PM   #3  
Posted By: Airman There are other numbers on your engine that will help further identify your engine and components. Just after the model number should be a Spec. No. and D.O.M. Post those if you would and I can determine more about your engine.

Is the carburetor the adjustable type? Does it have idle and main adjustment screws?
Thanks for the book Airman! I have taken all the numbers I could find off the engine and unit, and using the link have determined the carb to be a float type Group 3 or 4. It appears to be the most adjustable of the ones listed. (Has screws for main and idle jets)

Here are the numbers I could find so far:

Mastercraft (Canadian Tire) 8HP, 26" Snowblower

Engine: HMSK80
Carb # 1432F6H
Plug Type: Champion J19LM
Canadian Tire Model #:317E643F515
MFG Code: 1G09612-0285

I hope this helps, thanks!

 
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12-15-08, 05:09 PM   #4  
tecumseh 8 H.P.

Did you check the compression. Also is the spark occuring at the right time.

 
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12-15-08, 06:48 PM   #5  
See if you can find the Spec. No. on the engine. This number should be on the engine next to the model number. The number will begin with 155 and be seven digits. You need this number to get correct parts.

You said, “there is compression heard”. You really need to know the condition of the combustion chamber before you go too far. A compression test would be very beneficial but you can make a reasonable assumption of compression by holding your finger over the spark plug hole a crank the engine. Good compression will blow your finger off the hole.

Follow the manual to clean your carburetor but here are some tips:

The early fully adjustable pre-emission carburetors are sometimes impossible to repair. If you will look in the service manual Chapter 3 page 10, you will find an illustration showing a cross section view of the style carburetor you have. The illustration shows the “IDLE AND INTERMEDIATE FUEL TRANSFER PASSAGE” and the “METERING ROD OR PIN IN FUEL TRANSFER PASSAGE”. A common problem on carburetors of this type is the metering rod or pin will become corroded or varnished blocking the idle passage. To determine if this is the problem remove the carburetor from the engine and remove the bowl, float and needle. Give the carburetor a shake. If you do not hear/feel a rattle the metering rod or pin is corroded or varnished in place. You will be one extremely lucky and rare person if you can free it up and open the passage. If the metering rod is not free, your engine will not run at a stable RPM, it will surge.

Remove the float, needle and inlet needle seat. Make a polishing tool from a wooden meat skewer, or suitable substitute. A Q-tip may work if it will fit tightly in the needle cavity. Wrap one end of the skewer with a small amount of cotton and dip in metal polish. The wrapped tip should fit tightly in the needle cavity. Insert into the needle cavity and rotate skewer back and forth with your fingers 20 to 30 times to clean and polish the needle cavity. Next, dip a clean Q-tip in gas or solvent and insert it in the cavity clean the cavity.

After installing the inlet needle seat, needle and float. Place a few drops of solvent or fuel on the inlet needle. Pressure tests the inlet needle by inverting the carburetor and applying 5-15 PSI air pressure to the fuel inlet fitting. A seat that functions properly should hold the pressure. Move the float with your finger and observe that it moves freely.

Remove welch plugs and clean behind them. Totally disassemble the carburetor and probe holes with copper wires, spray every hole, nook and cranny with cleaner. Blow out with compressed air and when you are satisfied is clean, clean it again.

I use an inexpensive Auto-Zone parts store brand aerosol carburetor cleaner to clean carburetors, I rarely dip carburetors.

When assembling the carburetor insure the float spring clip is installed correctly.

Good luck and let us know how it goes.

 
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12-15-08, 07:15 PM   #6  
"Give the carburetor a shake. If you do not hear/feel a rattle the metering rod or pin is corroded or varnished in place."

I do not believe this is the case with an HMSK80. If the idle mixture screw on the side is stepped down to a thin tip it does not have the metering pin.

 
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12-16-08, 05:03 AM   #7  
Posted By: smallengineguy "Give the carburetor a shake. If you do not hear/feel a rattle the metering rod or pin is corroded or varnished in place."

I do not believe this is the case with an HMSK80. If the idle mixture screw on the side is stepped down to a thin tip it does not have the metering pin.
Something rings a bell with what smallengineguy says. He may be correct on this carburetor not having the metering rod, I hope so. The Spec. No. will confirm it for me. It will be Thursday before I get back to my shop and can look it up on the microfiche to verify. I will need the Spec. No. to look it up unless I look at every engine made.

If someone else has the microfiche or the new Tecumseh parts system they can look it up and verify the existence of the metering rod.

FYI: My distributor quit with Tecumseh parts last year. This year I had a couple of Tecumseh jobs I did not have parts on hand for and had to have the customer find parts. Next year I will no longer work on Tecumseh engines, which is only around 10 percent of my business. What really concerns me is parts availability for Tecumseh/Peerless transmissions. They are probably the majority of my transmission work. Tecumseh has shut down operations in the U.S and to my knowledge; they are not going to supply parts in the future.

 
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12-16-08, 05:25 AM   #8  
"What really concerns me is parts availability for Tecumseh/Peerless transmissions."
Tecumseh engine plants are shut down. Not sure about the Peerless Transmission plants. Tecumseh IS trying to sell Peerless. It really sucks that the investment group that bought Tecumseh only wanted the Cooling/Air conditioning portion of Tecumseh.

 
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12-16-08, 05:36 AM   #9  
Modern times are truly a sad state of affiars when businesses are bought and sold with no regard to their function, just "shareholder value". It means we will all end up with nothing eventually. Ah well, at least there are enough of us out there keeping the old stuff running!

That said, I will definately run a compression test on this unit before going too much further. I am away from the unit until this weekend but have asked my roomate to take a look and see if she can find the spec code. I'll post it here as soon as it is found.

Thanks for all the help so far!

 
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09-30-09, 06:56 PM   #10  
Tecumeseh Snow King 8HP w/ HMSK80

Last winter, I had my carburetor refurbished at the local shop. I didn't get it back until end of this summer. Needless to say I couldn't remember exactly how things were connected. But, there were only few loose items, and was easy enough to put everything together. However, there seem to be some kind of connecting piece is missing from throttle attachment. I checked with the 692509 Tecumseh Technician's Handbook, Page 32 online, but the illustration is not clear. Anyone knows any information as to where I can acquire clearer diagram. The system works with manually manipulating the carb otherwise.

Thanks for your help.

 
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10-01-09, 05:24 AM   #11  
Posted By: NKG0319 Anyone knows any information as to where I can acquire clearer diagram.

Thanks for your help.
My Snow King ended up needing a total clean up of the magneto system. There was so much rust that it couldn't fire the spark plug at all. it nw is running great, I have the engine here is there a picture of something I could take to help you on your quest?

 
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10-01-09, 06:02 AM   #12  
That'll be great if you can post me a closeup photo of the area. Specifically, I need to see the side view of the carburetor and it's attachments, especially to the throttle cable, the end that activate speed. I'm sorry you have to take the cover off for this exposure.

Thanks.

 
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10-14-09, 11:22 AM   #13  
Posted By: NKG0319 That'll be great if you can post me a closeup photo of the area. Specifically, I need to see the side view of the carburetor and it's attachments, especially to the throttle cable, the end that activate speed. I'm sorry you have to take the cover off for this exposure.

Thanks.
Sorry NKG, I just saw my spam filter blocked this message. Do you still need this photo? I can take it this weekend when I get home. Just PM me if you wish.

 
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10-14-09, 11:48 AM   #14  
Posted By: viennatech Sorry NKG, I just saw my spam filter blocked this message. Do you still need this photo? I can take it this weekend when I get home. Just PM me if you wish.
That's okay viennatech, I couldn't wait any longer so I had to shipped to the dealer, which I really didn't wanted to do, but...I was really stumped. Everything was in place correctly as far as I could see. They're talking about possible snow near future, so I had to make a decision quickly.

 
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01-07-10, 05:02 AM   #15  
owner experience

I have one of these.

I suspect the problem is the carburetor. I think you could remove and dis-assemble it and clean it up yourself and then it should work. I have had to do this. I have found that in order to start it successfully I have to run it out of fuel each time. The carburetors are prone to gumming up. Under the fuel tank you might find a shut off valve on the fuel line. After you get this running always shut the fuel off after you are done and let it idle until the gas is completely out of the carburetor.

PS If it is like mine it also has a misleading label for the choke position. Mine works exactly opposite of how it is depicted. The choke has some kind of ratcheting system where you can feel it click a little bit. To start it I close it all the way and then open it one click. After it starts I can usually open it up to all the way and then close it one click until it warms up after a minute or two. Then I open it all the way. If I do these things it runs perfectly and works great.

 
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