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Craftsman GT Hydro Transaxle


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07-17-10, 10:30 AM   #1  
Craftsman GT Hydro Transaxle

I have a Craftsman GT 917.273220 with (I believe) a transaxle problem. Hy Transaxle sears part #163198 Transaxle 222-3010L.
The sears site does not have a breakdown for the Hytrans under this model number, however I also have a 917.273223 model in the shop and it has the same drive, and the sears site does have a breakdown. http://www.searspartsdirect.com/part...ken=partSearch

No movement when the drive lever is moved fwd or rev. When full fwd, it almost tries to move but then just a faint grind/whir/clicking can be heard. The drive lever also feels to have much lighter pressure on it than normal.
The lever to release the pump in order to push the tractor has the following effects:
When in position to push the tractor, the tractor will move and the input pulley can be turned by hand.
When in position to drive the tractor, the input pulley cannot be turned, however the tractor can be pushed freely with the clutch/brake released. The same faint grind/tick can be heard while pushing in this position.
I have checked all pulleys, belt, fan...etc. and all appears to be correct, also the shear keys on the axles are in tact.

I know these are not serviced/serviceable...??? but for a $1500.00 + unit....if the problem is in the transaxle and parts are available, is it cost effective for a customer to authorize exploratory surgery and possible repair?
Opinions or ideas on it being the transaxle and not the hydro also appreciated.

 
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07-17-10, 05:25 PM   #2  
BFHFixit,

Sounds like the same problem I had with the same drive system last month, The original brake shaft has a fine spline collar that connects the pump shaft to the trans-axle. This spline has stripped out causing slippage, The new replacement shaft comes as a one piece/press fit shaft/collar assembly.

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Good Luck

 
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07-18-10, 12:08 AM   #3  
Great thx tech, and good to see ya again
Hope I get the chance to explore it

 
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07-18-10, 05:31 AM   #4  
Thanks BFHFixit,

But, Just to mention.....That trans-axle assembly...... It's a pita for one person to R&R from the tractor....


Good Luck

 
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07-18-10, 12:22 PM   #5  
Thx for the heads up Tech. Since any repair or replacement will require removing the unit at least I can count on that challenge
Looks as though to replace the brake shaft also requires splitting the case?
I have located a service manual for the unit, however the troubleshooting/diagnosis does not address the situation I have. Would be nice if I could verify the pump is not the problem.
The customer has located a unit on ebay that claims to have a bad pump with a good transaxle....? Hydrogear Transaxle 163198 222-3010L - eBay (item 270607328153 end time Aug-12-10 13:41:49 PDT)
In a perfect world just swapping out the pump would be the least expense...however it is looking as though the only way to verify anything is removal and inspection...unless you have another sleeve with a trick left

 
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07-18-10, 01:54 PM   #6  
Yes, The tans-axle has to be split to replace the brake shaft.

One trick is still up my sleeve I guess, Raise the rear tires off the ground. Start the unit and give it full throttle in forward or reverse and see if either tire moves at all, If not put your foot against one and watch the other. If you get any movement at all it's safe to assume the pump shaft is moving, You can also put a looong bladed screwdriver against the pump body and should hear the pump change directions when going from forward to reverse briskly with the control handle.

I'd be willing to bet the drive assembly on ebay has a stripped drive shaft as well, Seee.....When the pump is removed the pump shaft slides out of the collar easier being coarser splines leaving it on the brake shaft. The only way to actually check the fine splines on the brake shaft is to reach down into the cavity with long nose pliers and remove the collar or try spinning the collar briskly with both axles pinned.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and put my quarter on the brake shaft/collar.....

 
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07-18-10, 02:33 PM   #7  
Thanks much,
I think its a solid limb you got there and I prolly gonna join ya

Will apply the tests you mentioned also

Thx again

 
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07-19-10, 12:47 PM   #8  
Posted By: 31YTech Yes, The tans-axle has to be split to replace the brake shaft.

One trick is still up my sleeve I guess, Raise the rear tires off the ground. Start the unit and give it full throttle in forward or reverse and see if either tire moves at all, If not put your foot against one and watch the other. If you get any movement at all it's safe to assume the pump shaft is moving, You can also put a looong bladed screwdriver against the pump body and should hear the pump change directions when going from forward to reverse briskly with the control handle.
That's just how it is Movement on the wheel opposite the brake disc and can get movement on the wheel with the disc by holding the other one as well, just not as much and it kinda has to spin up a bit.
Diff seems to be working too, spin one wheel and the other spins opposite but neither spin independently.

Posted By: 31YTech I'm gonna go out on a limb here and put my quarter on the brake shaft/collar.....
Couple of planks and some Beer 4U2 n we could build a nest on this limb.

Thanks again Tech

 
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07-19-10, 04:39 PM   #9  
Posted By: BFHFixit Couple of planks and some Beer 4U2 n we could build a nest on this limb.

My kind of nest.....





Gotta have AC.....A lazyboy and a fridge for the Beer 4U2 .

 
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07-19-10, 09:10 PM   #10  
Uhmmmm...... I guess I should prolly bring da beer eh?

 
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07-22-10, 08:22 PM   #11  
Green light to drop and open the tranny, got my "clean room" clean and ready, should get time next week to drop it and see sup?

 
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07-23-10, 09:38 AM   #12  
Was just fixin to inquire whuz sup with it !

 
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07-28-10, 07:02 PM   #13  
Got time to get the fender and tank removed and found an issue. Maybe just a problem of homeowners dishing out to much punishment :P.
I can only imagine this one got punished, likely in the reverse to snap this bracket...? Pretty sure its 1/4 if not 5/16 or 3/8. I do have a 110 wire feed w/o gas and grinders to bevel it...can I trust that or should I visit my buddy with a real welder
Seems it is only a 1/4-20 through bolt (to which the broken piece now freely rotates on) that holds it to the TA...
First pic is of the bracket pulled back, second is where it once attached.




 
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07-28-10, 08:22 PM   #14  
I've got a little gas-less wire feed as well and would recommend taking it to your buddy, I myself would add a piece of flat bar to the under side. Weld the top and grind smooth then weld all the way around the flat bar on the bottom, Don't believe it would ever break again.





BTW, I'd be takin a pressure washer or at-least a water hose to that thing so I could see what I was doing !

 
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07-28-10, 08:35 PM   #15  
Rite on!
Indeed still some cleaning to do. Just have it sitting in a clean zone and blew out what I could before removing the fender, pulled out much more after. Diggin the fins clear a bit n such then I will push it off to the wash zone
10-4 on the welding!
Thx agin

 
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07-30-10, 10:28 AM   #16  
Posted By: BFHFixit Seems it is only a 1/4-20 through bolt (to which the broken piece now freely rotates on) that holds it to the TA...
Spoke a bit too soon perhaps. The other through bolt did not seem to fair as well...





Just need to figure out how I want to clear the parking brake rod and should be ready to drop it out.

 
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08-04-10, 12:02 PM   #17  
Posted By: 31YTech When the pump is removed the pump shaft slides out of the collar easier being coarser splines leaving it on the brake shaft. The only way to actually check the fine splines on the brake shaft is to reach down into the cavity with long nose pliers and remove the collar or try spinning the collar briskly with both axles pinned.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and put my quarter on the brake shaft/collar.....
Ok I got it out and on the table and the pump pulled. The brake shaft collar came out still on the pump. I stuck it back in the unit on the brake shaft and no need for needle nose or brisk spinning...the thing is sloppier than a 3 dollar date...and I can spin it freely by hand. Can put a bit of a bind on it and get the axles to spin...
Didn't look too clean or spiffy inside. Rust colored puddy...not sure if assy grease got hot or water in system or both or....

Hope to get it split this week...depends on how the haying goes.

Thanx for the tip on the hoses...guess I am used to seeing hydraulic hoses with one time use clamps and thinking extreme high pressure....aviation and industrial apps.

 
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08-04-10, 06:39 PM   #18  
Haha.....Where can I get one of these 3 dollar dates ???

Good to hear everything is working out OK, You'll be a Sears GT hydro ace in no time !

 
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08-07-10, 11:32 AM   #19  
Posted By: 31YTech Haha.....Where can I get one of these 3 dollar dates ???

Posted By: 31YTech Good to hear everything is working out OK, You'll be a Sears GT hydro ace in no time !
Looks like just the brake shaft and one bad bearing for the jack shaft on the reduction gear is all it needs, seal and O-ring and filter too.
Got the case empty and wiped down, not near enough debris to make up for the lost bearing pieces...prolly shoulda checked the oil eh?
Maybe I can check the filter to see if I can pick it up with a magnet
These things aint all so bad...heck I barely even sceered ne more
You've been a wealth of info and help Tech! Really appreciate it!

 
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08-09-10, 02:36 PM   #20  
Bit of an issue removing this blind hole bearing. Even after becoming the proud new owner of a 3lb slide bearing puller...I managed to rip the lip off the outer race. After trying a few suggestions and ideas of my own, I called a local (not much local biz out here so always looking for a way to meet neighbors ) machine shop and he gave me an easy tip to try....
He asked if I had a welder...yep, he said if you can weld on the race itself, then cool it, it will fall out
Since I don't even have a proper press, and the bearing is surely an interference fit, I asked what he would do the entire swap for...10 or 15 dollars he says! Beer 4U2 Thats my kinda neighbor!
Once I get the bearing, this week, I will take it over and see how it goes.
This is a rather large job for my hillbilly shop, just want to thank all for their help and not tiring of my queries...and the customer/parts department, for patience and confidence.

Scott

 
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08-30-10, 07:51 PM   #21  
Not lost or given up...just waiting on parts

 
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09-13-10, 12:45 PM   #22  
Progress:

Bearing race removed and new bearing installed. New parts all on hand. I had tried to chisel the edge of the race and got into the casting as well so his welder trick didn't quite do it. He did put a couple nubs on the race and tried a puller but it just wasn't gonna play nice. He had a nice little rotary file he took a groove out of the race then we could get under an edge and work it out.
I was able to find This locally but not the Locktite product.
From all the info I can find permatex and loctite were once one and it should be the same product essentially...? Also will one tube be enough? or should I have a second one on hand...

I also got the cross member scabbed up. He didn't run a bead on the top side and even with the 1/4" gusset underneath, I might still run a bead on top and grind it back down.

Sure glad I made a home for this project been a month or more so I will be scratchin me head for a couple days getting back in the groove with it.

You've been spot on Tech....sure appreciate your time! Beer 4U2

 
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09-13-10, 07:00 PM   #23  
Hey....No problem Scott, Glad to help !


Yeah, I've used both sealers. My local NAPA stopped carrying the Permatex and went to Locktite.

You shouldn't need a 1/4 tube on this job, I don't apply a bead as the instructions state. I squirt a little on my finger and apply it to the full width of the sealing surface about .030" thick, That way I know I'm getting a good seal.

Over a month huh, Mine was apart that long as well..... Digi cams are wonderful things...... Hahaha ! Beer 4U2

 
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09-22-10, 12:11 PM   #24  
Well I am running out of parts

Actually went up and in better n I had thought

Filled with oil and purged. Still on stands and a bit high, will set some wheels on it, run it a bit and do last check on oil level. Then just fender n seat and go try and pull up a stump

Been a fun experience, still hope it comes to an end here soon.

Thanks again for steppin me through Beer 4U2

 
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09-22-10, 02:29 PM   #25  
My apologies for the missing photos in this thread. My photo site decided to double their price to nearly $100.00/year, and I just am not that gleeful with the site nor that prosperous.

Should anyone wish to see the photos, I have them still and another site I can upload too, but 31YTech has similar photos, actually better, and I relied on and used, if he cares to share the link.

 
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09-23-10, 03:29 PM   #26  
Again Scott, No problem...... Glad I could lend a hand....

Now ya put me on the spot;

I did this job for a friend here at home to save him shop labor, I didn't have room in my home shop to work inside due to my old pickup getting a frame off restoration. So, This job was done under my canopy.

I took the pics because I knew it would be at- least a month before my friend had the money for parts (ended up being close to two). I just didn't want to rely on my memory with so much having to come apart for this type job.

Here's the pics I took showing linkage/brackets and hoses that had to be taken loose.

It's been plenty long enough, Post back in here you pulled two stumps at once !!! Beer 4U2

 
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09-23-10, 06:58 PM   #27  
Posted By: 31YTech Again Scott, No problem...... Glad I could lend a hand....

It's been plenty long enough, Post back in here you pulled two stumps at once !!! Beer 4U2
Well the second stump needed a lil nudge but wheelies are no problem now

 
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09-24-10, 04:11 AM   #28  
Hahaha..... THAT'S what I've been waiting to hear !!!

 
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