98 craftsman gt hydro stopped working

ok i just bought the tractor and got it home and went to put it up and the tractor started to whine and then started to grind , all coming from the transxel. my main concern is that the fluid looked like chocolate milk and was leaking out of the axel some where . after the whine and grind thats when it stopped and wouldnt move again . i seen someone post about it could be a brake shaft or somthing that has stripped out internally . i was told by the guy i got it from that a shop told him it may be the fluid since its obviously gotten water in it may have froze and is blocking the fluid flow . i have not been able to find anything on what type of fluid or or even a weight to possably change this and get the tractor moving again . for reference here are the numbers off the tractor so you know what i have . model 917.272962 serial 121.900a003273 i also cant find a part number for the fly wheel as the magnets for the charging system were removed due to they had the motor locked up . its a 20hp twin kohler command . thanks to anyone that helps with my new headache , they guy is offering to give me my money back but ill be out 30$ in gas from going and getting the rider . but im not sure if i want my money back or try to fix it . any suggestions ??

 

http://www.searspartsdirect.com/part...rue&pathTaken=

 

Unless you got this for a heck of a deal, take the money back. With grinding sounds going on, damage is probably done. I can't see which mower you have since the sears site is down at the moment, but most of them have no provisions to drain or change the hydro fluid and grinding, loss of motion, and chocolate milk colored fluid usually means bad tranny. The flywheel, if bought new, is going to set you back a lot too.

 

This transaxle you can actually change the fluid and filter and get internal parts for. It can get into some cash though, depending on what the problem is.

This thread has some details of one I replaced the brake shaft in this past summer.

If you decide to do it, I still have the manuals and parts resources likely. I would be willing to share via email. The fluid is just 20/50 motor oil.
I guess as cheese said, it depends on what you got it for and just how big of a project you want to take on.

 

yea i seen the posting about the brake shaft i think it was early this year ... i only have 150$ in it bu there are so issues like i have to get a new fly wheel the magnets are gone due to they had locked the motor and the guy that i bought it from figured this out and pulled the fly wheel and didnt bother putting the magnets back in place with some type of glue ... then the head lights dont work not shure why and there is several other things to that is wrong with it ... to an extent i think i got a good deal as it came with wheel weights the mower deck and a 46inch dozer blade , but the blade needs trip springs and i need the mounting brackets that go under the tractor ... if you would pls send the info .. im hopeing that its just the fluid that is the problem ... i may go ahead and change it and try to get it moving again then after a bit of use ill change it again ... hopefully to get all the nasty oil out . is there any specific brand of oil or would synthetic be better then regular oil ... THANKS A BUNCH ...

 

Send me a message with an email address and I will send you the manual. It has the service info.
I would change the filter, I think it runs about 15 bucks, and the oil the manual has some specs, but any good grade oil will work. I don't recall right off what the manual said about synthetic, but I wouldn't use it at least until you find out if its gonna work or not.
The headlights might run right off of the lighting/charging coil, so with no magnets, they may not be getting power.
You might look around for a used flywheel too and get the lighting coil as well. I imagine if the magnets locked up the engine, it is likely damaged as well.
I think these are really some good lil tractors if taken care of.

 

ahh thats right the headlights do i bet ...... i tottally spaced that one .. lol ok thanks again . ill send the pm with my e-mail n a couple

 

I see now ( the sears site is back up ). These trannys are pretty tough. I think I'd drain and refill as suggested and see what happens. I like these mowers and your price was fair considering.

 

thats what i think im going to do in the mean time the previous owner is looking for a used rear axel ... i have had 3 different prices now from sears one for 226 one for 308 and a third for 1300 and a repair shop close to me gave me a price of 1900. http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...milies/eek.gif i could see the 200 or 300 but a grand + for a garden tractor rear axel ! geesh .... http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m...fingernono.gif i think ill look in to gettin a used one if i can or even just part the rider out and keep a few parts for my self . the wheel weights will work on 2 of my other garden tractors and i can modify the frame on my yardman after getting it running to accept the dozer blade . its a hydro stat also but i think its built like a tank . with the motor on it running like crap it pulled my 1700lb camper like it was a small dump trailor in tow .... anyone know where the drain is on this and where to fill it @ ??? . i dont know much bout these but i know that my 1641 cub has a hydro rear axel that sears should get to put in these , can almost garentee these garden tractors by sears wouldnt be able to break them . my cub has enough low end power and combined with the hydro system on it , it will pull wheelies . when it was nice out i found that out by accident and got it up to bout a 45 degree angel n it was still up going on 10ft ... had to pull the drive lever down to get the nose outta the air b4 i hit my shed i was heading towards ... i cant wait to get it running good and all the small things fixed ...

 

I sent you the Hydro Gear service manual.
There is no drain. When you change the filter the best way to drain is to remove a hose from the filter housing that goes to the lowest part of the TA.

 

great thanks ... i was just looking over it to get an idea on what i needed to do and get ... looks like come sunday or monday ill have my hands full ... and hope its just the oil thats the issue , but something tells me other wise .... THANKS AGAIN FOR YOUR HELP ....

 

BFHFIXIT

would you have a manual on this transaxel this is what sears says mine has ... i called a place not far from me earlier and the guy said he thought he had a couple axels that was good ... my next question would i be better off if i can get a complete tractor that needs a motor and swapping motors to a frame with a geared rear axel or would the hydro system hold up ? i will be pushing snow and when spring hits pulling a large lawn roller that i can fill with water . also im planing on making a hitch to mount to the back of the frame to pull other riders that i need moved with out having to have 2 ppl to move them ...it will be similar to the back of a tow truck with a electric winch after i get all the bugs worked out . this way if i get any riding mowers gave to me i dont have to figure out how to get them on my trailer if they dont roll or are really heavy ... i can just hook the winch to them and lift the front off the ground enough to move them by myself ..


Product Model #: 917.272962
Part #: 163198
Sub Component: Non-illustrated
Key #: NI
Part Description: TRANSAXLE HYDRO GEAR 222-3010L

 

Here is a parts breakdown, I don't have a service manual but I am sure the one I sent still has the info you need to service yours.
Not sure what else you are asking...

IMO, you can't go wrong with a hydro over a geared drive, especially ergonomically and if you are going to be pushing or pulling heavy loads.
I think it is well worth the price of filter and oil to find out just what you have with it, but again, that is just my opinion.
I have about four of these that I service and maintain for customers, and that engine has never been a problem on any of them. As a matter of fact, if I could get two of those engines, I would build my own ultralight plane around them
Maybe others have experienced problems with longevity or other issues, but I have not personally.
I think the belt used for the drive is certainly a weak point and may need replacing more often than some others, but that motor and TA combo has never failed to make my mouth water for one of my own. Even though my early 90's MTD hydro units with the old Briggs L=head 18HP twins are still keeping me going. Despite one of them only wanting to turn to the right, the engine tranny combo getsrdun

I pickup riders from all sorts of areas, pole barns out in fields, pastures, inside old barns...etc. I use a boat winch and strap when they won't move and I am unable to get them too with a brief diagnosis. Always a come along too.

 

i just want to make sure in the long run i dont have to replace another hydro unit if i can help it ... ive got a old sears suburban with high low and it would pull anything it was hooked to as long as you had the weight to compensate on the front .. this makes only the 3rd hydro tractor ive had the other being my 1641 and i know it will pull, and the one of the others has proven its self a yardman garden tractor with 20hp kohler magnum , then the third a 96 murry with a hyrdo/ automatic that wont pull squat ! ive got a 76 murry that at the time was set up with a 11hp briggs and a dump trailer that was full of sand and it out pulled the hydro auto tractor pulling the trailor full of sand ... like i said i just want to make sure i have the right one for what im going to be putting it thru .. at some point ill be not only pushing gravel to level my drive thats humped , but also pushing dirt when spring comes and i can get some dropped to level my yard .. thanks yet again for the info you have sent and the help ... i am going to try the oil/ filter come either sunday or monday if i can get the filter number to cross with a filter i can get cheaper then what sears wants , they list it as 30-35$ i think it was .. and thats more then i have to spend at this point ..

 

It should be worth dropping in a used tranny if need be. I think I have one of those trannys sitting around too.

 

well if i can get a tranny on the cheap id be ok .. i have a local shop that i guess from what i was told has a mower junk yard there to ... lol and they guy i talked to is supposed to be checking on if he has one . he said he thought he did have a good one but had to look . he is suppose to get back with me this week end ( but i think he spaced at the time that is the holiday on sat ) lol witch is no biggie to me since im going to spend a few $ to try the oil / filter first . i just wish i could find what the sears number for the filter would cross to for a filter like fram or something that i can get on the cheap so if it dont work im not out that much money. then if it would happen to work ill run the rider bout a week or so and then change everything to better oil / filter . if i had a magnet that would stay on the filter id put on it to catch the metal particals ... cheese you think that a hydro would stand up to that kind of abuse ??? not that im saying i dont trust BFHFIXIT or anything like that i just like other opinions and just dont want to get this other tranny and it go out to , when i could have gotten a geared tranny with high / low and been ok .

 

Yeah, that tranny should hold up well. Some of the little hydros like you see on murrays and the other smaller mowers don't hold up to abuse as well, but this one is garden tractor quality. It should take most anything you put it up against. If you really give it a workout, give it a chance to cool down once in a while (if you're pulling a small plow or pushing a snowblade for hours on end).

 

I picked up a 97 craftsman garden tractor in September this year that 'had a belt problem'. Turned out to be the brake shaft small splines were stripped. My hydro is the earlier version that has weak case issues. All other internal gears showed no wear. I left the old filter on to catch any silicon scrapings that might have fallen in during prep for reassembly. Filled with regular motor oil, purged, & ran for about an hour before changing old filter. There was a noticeable change in torque for climbing slopes with the new filter.

What I found on searching for info about my problem helped a great deal.
0. Don't mess with the pump unless you know it is bad or weak.
1. It is relatively easy to split the case & change the brake shaft or other parts.
2. Use the wheel near the brake rotor as a stand (not needed to remove for work).
3. Power wash before disassembly.
4. Make sure all the case bolts are removed before popping apart. There is a recessed one near the rotor that is not readily visible.
5. Replace the crimp-on hose clamps with 'usa' made screw clamps if you can find them.
6. Clean the old silicon off by thoroughly scraping it off.
7. Replace the old brake shaft parts with the new ones from the brake kit.
8. Put about a 1/8" thread of gasket grade silicon on the flat edge of the lower housing.
9. Put the top housing back on, tighten all the bolts snugly, & let it sit overnight before filling with oil.
10. Change out old filter after purging & running for a while.

Sorry to be so wordy & you probably know most of what I said but I've learned it's best to say more than not enough. Luckily most people seem to understand this.

For anyone that has a Hydro-gear transaxle # 222-3010L also known as 163198 please email me. My old case is developing hairline cracks & I would like to replace it. It can be a good one or one that might need work.

I also found comments about using an 'anti-foaming oil' to reduce air bubbles in pump that affect oil flow. But do not seem to have a 'foaming' problem. Supposedly prevents or reduces need for purging. Hydro-gear 'says' to use Mobil 1 synthetic 'probably due to cold weather areas'.

 

Tex,
I agree with most of what you posted but not all of it.
I don't agree with using the old filter regardless for anything once you have split the case and made any repairs. All should have been cleaned well enough and any material allowed to set, why take a chance of introducing any FOD back into the system from an old filter...?
Also regular silicon gasket maker I would not use here, most of this info is mentioned in this thread and a more appropriate gasket material or this

 

Thanks for the gasket info, I'll use one of those next time I have to split the case. I differ on leaving the old filter on to catch any crud that might have been left in the case from splitting. If there is any crud, why let a new filter catch it. This would allow for the premium oil & the new filter to be added after verifying that all was well with the repair. Any idea where a 163198/222-3010l 'used' might be available? Thanks

 

Well filters only filter so much, and once full can bypass or even stop filtering, so any FOD that may have been in the old filter could be re-introduced to the system. Some systems even have a bypass that when the filter has enough resistance, it bypasses the filter to maintain oil pressure where needed. If you do it right the first time, then there should be no crud needed to filter out after a proper repair. The main difference being a 35 dollar filter or a 1500 dollar pump or trans axle. This is more common in aviation and may or may not apply here, however, your suggestion is still not the best practice.
As far as a used Tranny, cheese mentioned maybe having one or two laying around, read the previous posts.

Peace

 

thanks on the info cheese and bfhfixit and texasgeezer . im going the latter route as i have talked to a couple shops bout this and they are leaning with my idea that with the grinding noise something went out . to change the oil and filter is going to run bout 40$ between the stuff and the gas to go to the closest shop that sells the filter , one place the guy gave me a guestamet ( a rough idea on the price even though i gave him the part number ) I WONT be dealing with that shop since he couldnt give an exact price on the filter besides giving 2 different price ranges one of 10-15 second was 15-18$ for the hydro gear brand filter witch is what i asked for the price on ... texasgeeser my suggestion is try a site like craigslist and post in the garden section for what your needing . here in indiana we have a site thats lil more primitive to craigslist but does just as good if not better as in the last week i have gotten a total of 4 replys 1 i never heard back from that had a complete tractor , another that was the wrong size tractor ( guy didnt know the difference between a garden tractor and a lawn tractor and thought the back wheels on his bolted on with one bolt ," keep in mind this was a sears tractor NOT A MTD " ) till he went out and looked and seen it was held on with a e-clip not a bolt ... i have 2 pending deals but my question is the one i have info on now is the older body style like mine but has the plastic fender flares other wise similar to mine i am getting the whole rider other then the motor / front axle and hood but get a complete rear axle including wheels and tires look good dash is there and i get the deck to ... im asking for your opinion on the rear axle to make sure it looks the same as mine , i know the frame in back looks different then mine i have pics i can send of the rear axle thats still on the frame . here are the links to the pics from my photobucket account . the pic with a sleeve hitch looks more like the back of my craftsman gt then the pic with the axle in it . http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m.../Image0072.jpg http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m...n03/hitch2.jpg http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m.../Image0071.jpg after getting the axle out of the parts frame and getting it installed i plan on running it for a bit to get the fluid worked thru then changing the fluid and filter . since i will be going out of town to pick the parts up ill pick the filter up from a reliable mower sales and service shop so it wont cost me a bundle and will stop at autozone and get the 20-50 oil and i wont go n just buy cheap stuff ill get the good quality oil so i know it will hold up ... hope you guys dont mind the links to the images maybe sometime you can let me in on the word links ... BFHFIXIT thanks for the link to the other posting on the brake shaft i forgot to bookmark it for reference but got it now ! http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...ies/coffee.gif http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...es/thinker.gif

 

If you type the text you want, then highlight it, then click on "insert link" ( in the upper tool bar of the post,(the earth with a paperclip) then paste the link in the window that follows....

 

thanks bfhfixit . i went out today since it was almost 60 degrees out today and checked the rider and after putting the battery cable back on i fired it up and it started rolling forward , so i moved the drive lever forward and it moved more ... since its moving again with no whine or grind , im thinking i got real lucky on this and nothing is hurt . so i am going monday to get a filter ( hydrogear brand ) and change it , run it a while and then bout time it gets nice and warm in spring bout april ill change it again ... i bought castrol gtx 20w-50 should this be good ? i got some marvel mystery oil im going to add to the oil as well in both motor and rear axle for a lil more protection ... texasgeesezer i forgot to add on my last post that cheeze said he may have one that would work , he is a state or so away georga i think ,if you cant find one local i will have a second hydro axle out of a 98 the body style that has the black fender flares hope fully next week end . ill be picking up a parts rider thats missing the hood motor , but will have a spare deck and prolly be selling my 46" from this one if the other deck will work on mine to as its a 50" .http://www.f150online.com/forums/ima...lies/beers.gif HAPPY NEW YEARS GUYS http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h1...eersmiley1.gif