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Toro CCR 2000 snowblower revs hi and low


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12-16-12, 01:19 PM   #1  
Toro CCR 2000 snowblower revs hi and low

Hello,

I have a CCR 2000 toro snowblower. It starts fine but revs high and low. It is a bowl carb. I haved taken the carb off twice and done a real good cleaning.

I tried to adjust the air/idle screw which does not do a thing. I even tried to adjust the governor screw which made no difference as well.

Cannto seem to figure this one out. Float looks good in the carb, The needle works properly, so lots of gas.

Just revs hi and low continually.

I have attached a pic.

Any idea what it is or what I can try.

Only other thing I did not do was replace the plug. Faulty plug maybe? Spark was strong when i removed it and tested it.

ANything would help.

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12-16-12, 01:37 PM   #2  
Not the spark plug - either fuel or governor. What engine is it? Try putting the choke on 1/4, then 1/2 see if that evens it out.

 
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12-16-12, 01:43 PM   #3  
I beleive it is a suzuki engine.

The choke does nothing. On or off, does not matter. I can start it without choke cold.

When the choke is 1/4 or 1/2 or off, it does the exact same thing. Revs hi and low.

 
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12-16-12, 03:14 PM   #4  
When you cleaned the carburetor, were you able to get to the main jet and clean it up? How far did you disassemble the carb when you cleaned it?

 
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12-16-12, 05:52 PM   #5  
I took the main jet out, the air idle screw and one more screw that went in on the top of the carb.

All three i would use carb cleaner, a small wire to get in the holes, then blow them all out with an air compressor. I am beginning to think there is a inlet inside of this carb that may be clogged. I sent carb cleaner in every inlet possible. I blew the air compressor through them all as well. I can tell you, the air idle misture screwed on the top that goes in on an angle does absolutely nothnig. I can turn it clockwise all the way in and the engine will not die, just revs up and down. I can see the throttle moving back and forth with the governor arm.

I also took the float off and the float needle. The bowl gasket is in good shape.

I pretty much stripped it right down,

Any other ideas?

 
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12-16-12, 07:45 PM   #6  
The surging is a lean condition so while it is running spray/dribble some carb/brakeparts cleaner behind the carb and along the intake mating surfaces, if the engine tempo changes you have an air leak and can take the appropriate action. Have a good one. Geo

 
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12-18-12, 05:47 PM   #7  
Geo,

I totally agree with you that the engine is running lean. I sprayed the intake around all the gaskets and no change at all to the operation. Still revs up and down.

The only other thing I should add is there is a small leak at the jet on the bottom of the bowl. Surely there must still be enough gas in the bowl to meet the need sof the engine. I mean it is only a small leak. Its not the bowl, I beleive its the little gasket around the jet on the outside of the bottom of the bowl.

I should add that the jet on this carb is screwed into the passage going up to the venturi. The jet is not on the bottom of the bowl.

If you look down at the carburetor, i am thinknig the one small vertical screw on the top of the carb is another jet. I cleaned this but I am thinking there may be a couple of passages there and one may be clogged.

I tightened that carb on very tight. I cant stand these carbs with the long bolts and spacer with gaskets, but after tightening real tight and spraying the carb cleaner with no change, Im still baffled.

Any other ideas.


Last edited by granatnl; 12-18-12 at 06:46 PM.
 
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12-18-12, 07:05 PM   #8  
I think there may be more than a lean condition. If you choke it with no effect, then either the final air/fuel mixture is not changing which means the choke circuit is plugged or the gas circuit is vented or there's something else causing the hunting (hi/low rev).

How did you determine the gasket on the jet was leaking? Anytime you have a gasket against a jet not sealing you may have the fuel supply problem there. It's unusual to have a gasket on a jet. Do you have pics of the carb dismantled, or is it back together now?

 
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12-18-12, 07:19 PM   #9  
The gasket on the botton of the bowl on ther ouside whehre the screw tithtens the bowl is what is not good. The screw on the bottom of the bowl os not a jet, just a screw to hold the bowl on.

The jet is up in the venturi. I have removed it and cleaned it, still no luck.

Choke has no effect when it is running.

Gas does leak a little bit on the bottom of the bowl but not enough for the bowl to be empty. Ill fix it tomorrow with another gasket.

It wants gas but isnt getting it. maybe there is not enough gas getting into the low idle orifices at the throttle end of the carb? I blew everything out.

ANy other ideas?

 
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12-19-12, 07:40 PM   #10  
Oh man,

Took the carb off again tonight for another cleaning. Had to be not enough gas.

I recleaned the main jet. It is a very small jet that screws into the passage way up to the venturi of the carb. I spratyed carb cleanier on it before. Well, looks like the carb cleaner was doing nothnig. Once i pushed a twist eye in there, all the gunk came out. The whole is now a lot bigger than what it was. Telling me now why it would rev. SOme gas was getting through enough to rev but not enough to get through to the low idle jet and even out the rpm.

Cant start it tonight as it is late but almost sure when I fire it up tomorrow, its a done deal.

Learning learning learning.

Ill update tomorrow.

Just picked up a 3hp mastercraft tecumseh for 20 bucks. The thing is about 8-10. looks like new, wont run. 1 Spray of quick start vroom. It starts then stalls. Bowl carb, beauty. Just need a clean. Nice pickup.

 
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12-19-12, 10:00 PM   #11  
In the pic, there is a little brass screw that looks to be screwed into the top of the carb. When you take this out, there is a hole that goes through the side, but then there is also a tiny tiny hole in the end of it. If this tiny hole is restricted, it will cause your problem, and that's usually where the problems are with these. A very thin wire will usually clean it out.


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12-20-12, 03:40 AM   #12  
Yes CHeese. Ive been in there. I did not have apiece of wire small enough to get in there. When I put it in my mouth and blow, i hear the ai going right through it. I am sure this is not recommended in the small engine business, but, sometime you just have to do what you have to do. Ill let you know tonight.

 
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12-20-12, 04:21 PM   #13  
arrrghh. fired it up tonight and exact same thing. surging. I cant beleive it. Thought I had it.

Stumped now. Any suggestions?

 
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12-20-12, 04:37 PM   #14  
Have you been able to use it to blow snow or does it just die out. I think I'd put some carb cleaner in the gas. I use Sea Foam with good results.

Most auto parts stores and Walmarts handle it.

It doesn't make any sense that your choke doesn't do anything and you can start it cold and what you're finding are restrictions in the jetting.

 
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12-20-12, 04:48 PM   #15  
No snow yet. I have not even tried it. Are you suggesting I should wait until we get some snow and see what happens when it is under load? I have a ccr1000 and it does not surge like this.

I jsut dont understand it either. The low idle jet does nothnig. The main jet is spotless. Ive cleaned every orifice of this carb. It is a bit rusted inside but everything moves freely. Choke does nothing as well. When I prome it rund for about 3 seconds, then surges.

SPent a lot of time on this one.

 
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12-20-12, 07:09 PM   #16  
No I don't think I would include waiting for snow in the fix plan. If you had run it under load without problems, it may eliminate the governor and main jetting as the problem and point towards the idle circuitry.

If you have rust in the area that typically runs fuel through it, the Sea foam may not help. It will work wonders on varnish, but not metal solids.or dirt. Never hurts to try it though. Just takes a couple of ounces in a quart of gas. You can save the rest of it for something else.

 
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12-20-12, 10:40 PM   #17  
Did this problem just start, or did it begin gradually, or...? I'm trying to think of what would cause it to surge and the choke not work at the same time. The only thing I come up with is a vacuum leak between the carb and head or some other problem in the carb. The throttle shaft isn't worn out is it?


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12-21-12, 04:52 AM   #18  
1) i bought the snowblower non running and figured I could fix this. Ill presume the problem was there with the previous owner but who knows.
2) While it was running, i sprayed carb cleaner around the carb to see if the cleaner would fill any leak. If there was a leak, the engine rpm would stabilize or at least change as the cleaner filled the gaps where the leak was. I had no luck there as well.
3) While running, when I prime it, she runs. I can keep it running much better if I pulsate the primer. This really tells me I have a fuel issue and it is most likely the low idle jet or the low idle adjustment.
4) The throttle shaft moves freely so there are no issue there.
5) Where can I find a rebuild kit for this carb. What sohuld I soak the carb in to ensure that all internal orifices of the carb are well cleaned and clear. Do I take it in for an elecrolytic bath and rebuild it with new parts?

Thank you,

 
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12-21-12, 05:48 AM   #19  
So the primer will add enough fuel to keep it evened out? I would say the fuel passages are still plugged. I would dismantle it completely, soak it in cleaner made for that purpose, then blow it out with compressed air.

When you blow it out, with the throttle shaft in place, put one hand over the mating surface to the engine block, wrap a wad of plastic around the air nozzle to seal it, and blow air into the carb from the inlet side. That will force air through the fuel circuit backwards to clean it out.

 
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12-21-12, 06:24 AM   #20  
I found the spring off going to the governor from the throttle. Let me reattach that and see what happens. Here is my carb.

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12-21-12, 06:37 AM   #21  
When cleaning the smalest hole in the carb jet a wire from a small twist tie usually fits to clean out that hole,I know a pro will tell you not to abrade that hole but do what you have to to make sure its cleaned out.Also a missing spring or a wrong linkage connection can cause surging.

 
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12-21-12, 09:02 AM   #22  
I put the spring back on, no change. Surging.

I will drop the carb off once again and soak it overnight until tomorrow. Blow it out backwards and see if it makes any difference.

Low air/idle screw is out about 1.5. No change when I turn it. im convinced the low jet and thelow air/idle passageways are not getting gas.

Let you know tomorrow.

 
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12-21-12, 09:28 AM   #23  
So the throttle shaft kicks on the choke, I take it. Then a spring returns it to no choke or is it controlled both ways by the throttle? Whichever, I would check that to make sure the choke plate is moving correctly.

If you go to the dismantle/soak and the throttle shaft or the choke shaft doesn't go through the other side of the carb throat, just plug both the intake and engine side of the barrel and blow the air through the top of either shaft.

 
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12-21-12, 11:00 AM   #24  
Ok, it is soaking now.

I also did not take off the plastic carburter insulator that is between the carb and the intake manifold. I took it off now and there are more holes in the end of the carb that need cleaning.

Lets see how it does soaking for 24 hours, ill pull it out tomorrow then blow the snot out of it with my air compressor. If this does not do it, we are at a crossroads.


Last edited by granatnl; 12-21-12 at 11:21 AM.
 
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12-22-12, 11:18 AM   #25  
No Luck.

I let the carb sit overnight is a degreaser. I bloew out evetything with the compressor. Starts up fine. Surges. I put a new gasket between the carb and the carb insulator. The only two gaskets left are from the insulator to the intake manifold and the intake manifold and the engine.

The only difference this time around was the surge was not as bad as previous. Still surges but not as hard. in ither words, the surges are more frequent.

Be such a shame to throw this on the junk.

Any other ideas? Anyone know where there is a cheap carb for these or an aftermarket alternative?

 
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12-22-12, 11:31 AM   #26  
Did you soak it in carb cleaner made for dissolving the varnish in the carb?


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12-22-12, 01:22 PM   #27  
Since you said the governor spring was off and put back on, have you tried holding the governor lever fixed and seeing if the surging stops or the engine stalls. Still puzzled about effect of choke. I would think applying choke would smooth it out if its lean and if its not lean then flood it out.

 
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12-22-12, 01:39 PM   #28  
Very puzzling this is. I did soak it in a degreaser. Gunk! I filled up a container then let it sit in it. Blew it out today with an air compressor.

When I hold the governor, as in, hold the throttle, at a normal idle speed, the engie will die, if I let go of the governor, it will snap for more gas and get it and surge.

 
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12-22-12, 04:08 PM   #29  
A degreaser isn't the same. There is stuff made specifically for soaking a carburetor.


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12-24-12, 09:51 AM   #30  
All,

I have the carb soaking once more. I also need the gaskets for this carb. The repalcement carb is 95-7935. I can find the carb but I cannot find the carb rebuilt kit. I can find the gaskets but wondering if there is a carb rebuild kit for this. I i am gonig to order gaskets, i may as well go for the entire kit.

If I have to make a gasket, what is the material made out of on the replacements gaskets so I but the same?

 
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12-27-12, 10:11 PM   #31  
What are you soaking it in?

Take the thing to your local shop and ask them to put it in their ultrasonic cleaner. If they won't do that for a very nominal fee, find a new local shop. The problem is very likely in your carburetor as you've figured out, and cleaning is the easiest step. Unfortunately, soaking an EPA certified carburetor in solvents often causes more harm than help. Seriously, things aren't what they used to be, and I was fixing them when they used to be.

That particular Suzuki engine is pure gold, so you're right in doing repair vs replacement. If you ever want to part with that 2000 make sure the local contractors know, they will trip over each other to get another one of those. As in best 2 stroke ever, but no longer made.

I can assure you that a cheap rebuild kit is available for that carb, please do not try to invent your own. I'm thinking less than $10.00 for the right one. That does sound like the problem. If that doesn't fix it, then it's time to move on to checking for air leaks.

By the way, if surging is the only issue then relax. That engine just surges, and I'm not sure why. If it is pulling strong and isn't dying out under load, then quit worrying. It surges, big deal. If it's moving snow, relax and let it work.

 
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01-03-13, 06:31 PM   #32  
OK, i think this will be the next step. Ill take it to the local shop and have them give it a a supier clean, I thought it was electrolytic bath but nonetheless, ill take it in and see what can be done to it.

Frustrating for such a good engine. Ill update once I have taken it off and have had it in for the super clean.

 
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