Toro snowblower won't start, kind of baffled

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  #1  
Old 12-16-16, 08:47 PM
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Toro snowblower won't start, kind of baffled

Newer, 4 year old single stage Toro Power Clear won't start. Ran beautifully all last winter.

Here's what I can tell you:

Primer bulb doesn't seem to be drawing/pushing in any fuel. It's not the type of bulb that fills up with fuel, it's the kind that uses air pressure to push fuel into the carb. Just a simple black button attached to a fuel hose that runs into the carb. It will run with a spray of carb cleaner into the carb body, but die after 5 seconds.

I can also confirm that fuel is flowing freely from the tank, through the filter and lines and into the carb as pulling the fuel line from the carb confirmed this. I also get a steady stream of fuel when I unscrew the float bowl bolt.

Here's what I have done:

1. Emptied out all old gas from last year, rebuilt the carb with a new needle and float bowl gasket, cleaned it out with wire, toothbrush, carb cleaner, and compressed air.

2. Installed new spark plug and have confirmed it's getting spark (it runs for 5 seconds with carb cleaner into the carb body)

3. Filled up with new gas

4. Have covered the end of the tube that runs from the primer bulb to the carb, there is resistance in the primer bulb, and I can feel it suck air back in when depressed. I have visually confirmed that there are no cracks or holes in the primer bulb, or the tube.

I'm kind of at a loss here. I can say with confidence that the primer bulb isn't the issue. When I press it, I can hear that it's forcing air into the carb, and when I release it, I can hear/feel that air is just getting sucked back up into the bulb. It sounds like there is an air leak somewhere inside the carb.

Any thoughts? Should I just buy a whole new carb?
 
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  #2  
Old 12-17-16, 05:29 AM
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All that primer bulb does is push air. With the line disconnected from the carb is the bulb pushing air through the line into the carb? If it is the carb must be plugged. That would need taking apart and cleaning or try a cleaner to take out the varnish.

I would drain all the gas out, then put about four ounces of Sea Foam in a quart of gas and dump that in the tank. Let is sit about fifteen minutes, then spin it over a few times with full choke and pump the primer a few times. Let will move the doctured up gas through the carb.

Let that sit for fifteen minutes and see if it will start with half choke full throttle, no primer.

If it doesn't take out the plug, spin it over a few times with no choke, full throttle, put a teaspoon of gas down the plug hole and try it again with no choke, full throttle.
 
  #3  
Old 12-17-16, 07:47 AM
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Post the model number so we can lookup what engine it has. Have a good one. Geo
 
  #4  
Old 12-17-16, 08:21 AM
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Update:

I woke up to a puddle of gas beneath the carb, so I know that A) I didn't tighten the float bowl screw enough and B) there is fuel flow into the carb

I disassembled the carb again and left the primer and tube hooked up. I can say that the primer is pushing air through the carb and I can feel it come out the gas line connector. So I feel as though the primer isn't the issue.

I was able to put everything back together and the engine will run for 2-3 seconds after being primed 10 times. It then dies, and won't start.

Is this a fuel delivery thing? Or is the main jet still clogged?

For what it's worth, I cannot unscrew the main jet as it doesn't have a flat head notch like most main jets. I am not sure how to remove it from the carb.

Model is a Toro 418 EZ or 38282
 
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Old 12-17-16, 09:03 AM
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Sounds like the primer "bulb" is working but you have not verified that it is functioning. With the bowl on and tight, full of fuel, when you prime it you should see fuel pump up into the throat of the carb. You seem to have verified that the primer is indeed pressurizing the bowl, however, with it full of fuel and the needle valve seated, fuel should be pumped up the main jet into the throat of the carb.
I doubt that this is the issue regardless as it should continue to run once it starts regardless of condition of the primer. These carbs rely on other circuits besides the main jet, and even when or if a kit is available (instances where a "kit" is actually a new carb) it is just as beneficial and economical to replace the carb.
 
  #6  
Old 12-17-16, 09:06 AM
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Yes, the primer is working and doesn't appear to be leaking. No cracks, holes or anything like that. But it's not getting fuel up through the carb. Perhaps there isn't enough fuel flow from the tank into the bowl and it's not getting to a level where the primer can pull fuel in?

Whole carb is $30 on Amazon—probably just the easiest thing at this point unless anyone has a suggestion on what to try.

To reiterate, I have disassembled carb (with the exception of pulling the main jet—can't figure that out) and have cleaned with carb cleaner, small wire, and compressed air. I have installed new float bowl, and float bowl screw seals, and have also installed a new plug and verified spark.

I have not replaced any fuel lines

I'd like to see a diagram of this carb, as I'm unsure of how to remove the main jet (the one that is visible only when you remove the float bowl).
 
  #7  
Old 12-17-16, 09:25 AM
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It may not be serviceable. Much of this is due to meeting EPA requirements for emissions and to prevent "Tampering" (adjusting or servicing that could render the equipment to operate outside emissions requirements).
 
  #8  
Old 12-17-16, 10:23 AM
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It sounds like your carb isn't worn out, but plugged with varnish accumulated since last year. If you do the same thing with a new carb you'll have the same problem next year.

Did you try the Sea Foam?
 
  #9  
Old 12-17-16, 12:56 PM
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I have cleaned the carb. I'm not sure what else I can do to the current carb.

The engine won't run long enough to cycle seafoam through it.
 
  #10  
Old 12-17-16, 03:41 PM
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You cycle the Sea Foam through it with the full choke on when cranking it a few times, then let it sit for fifteen minutes or so. It'll work on the varnish. If you're getting it to run for a couple of seconds off the primer you're moving some gas through it.

If the carb is at fault, then replace it, but if it needs cleaned, do that. The small all position carbs like those on chainsaws and two stroke applications are almost as cheap to replace compared to putting a kit in the carb. The average mechanical type person can swap the carb, but may have a problem putting a kit in them for different reasons.
 
  #11  
Old 12-17-16, 04:04 PM
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You keep saying you cleaned it, which means nothing.
Unless you completely took the whole thing apart and set it in an ultrasonic tank or at least disassembled it, spray carb. cleaner in all the ports and blew it out with air it's not clean.
Power tools like snow blowers, rototillers, ect. that only get seasonal use need to be run with non ethanol fuel, at the end of the season they have to be completley ran out of fuel.
You still have a fuel supply issue.
 
  #12  
Old 12-17-16, 06:22 PM
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i have worked on old Honda carbs so no stranger to disassembling them and reassembling.
 
  #13  
Old 12-17-16, 06:26 PM
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I have cleaned it as best I can given what I have...Compressed air, carb cleaner, and small cleaning wires. I have, on multiple occasions now, sprayed carb cleaner in all possible ports, have hit those ports with compressed air, and have cleaned ports and used a small gauge wire to get in all of the pinhole orifices. This should do the trick, unless for some reason the main jet—which is not removable—is the culprit.

I realize it's a fuel supply issue, I just can't seem to nail it.

Back out to the garage!
 
  #14  
Old 12-24-16, 11:39 AM
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Short of buying a new carb, what else can I try? The problem seems to be that the primer is not getting any fuel up through the main jet. So I'm not able to get the thing to run for longer than a couple of seconds.

The main jet appears to be non-serviceable so I'm not able to remove it and give it a thorough cleaning.

Soak carb overnight at this point? Hit it with more compressed air?

Confident it's a primer issue or something else I should look at?
 
  #15  
Old 12-24-16, 12:36 PM
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If the primer is forcing air, the issue is a plugged carburetor. If you didn't want to use the Sea Foam, then soak the carb and blow it out with compressed air. If you don't want to clean it, buy a new carburetor. I would be more inclined to clean the old one unless it was broken/worn out, etc.

You don't have to take out the main jet to clean it. You can usually look through those into the carb throat.
 
  #16  
Old 12-31-16, 06:16 PM
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I have neighbors on each side and across the street that all have 2 cycle toro snowthowers. Every year when it snows the first time, I hear the swearing and the cranking of engines. Then I get a knock on the door. I start them every time by shooting a stream of starting fluid (not carb cleaner). They start and when they start to stall I give them another shot of fluid to keep them running until they stay running. I'm sure the combination of the cleaning properties of the fluid and the vibration and some heat remove the varnish that got left there from old fuel. The moderators might delete me because this is dangerous, but it works for me.
 
  #17  
Old 12-31-16, 08:27 PM
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How about posting the engine model numbers usually stamped in the engine shroud by the spark plug so someone can look up the carb info. the main jet is clogged, it is the idle circuit vent that is causing the problem, the bowl nut is the main jet on most, some have the adjustment screw up through the bottom some don't. They all seem to have the tiny hole near the top which is almost invisible on some, I use the wire from a twist tie to clean it. Get the bowl nut clean and the engine will run. Have a good one. Geo
 
  #18  
Old 12-31-16, 09:34 PM
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The moderators might delete me because this is dangerous, but it works for me.
That is a viable solution if used with common sense. Only need to give the shortest blast possible and then only a few times. It can help start fuel flow and possibly pass small clogs or problems.
The danger comes from over use and possible back fire, also too much can cause damage to the engine. Over use will also wash the cylinder of oil and shorten engine life.
 
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