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Briggs & Strat 10HP 'genpower' FLYAWAY governor


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09-30-17, 09:06 PM   #1 (permalink)  
Briggs & Strat 10HP 'genpower' FLYAWAY governor

Same problem

Same exact problem as link above, I tried to reply to that post but site wouldn't let me. Final response was that a spring was missing to hold back the governor, which makes sense with the backstory of this piece of equipment.

What I am unable to determine is what spring, and where does it go?

Running with choke still on in full tach reads 3300-3400 which is so close to whats needed! Ahh! One click of choke towards run position and rpms exceed 4800 and volt meter reads over 200v YIKES! I only let it run like this for as long as it took to read the instrumentation I already had set up. So a matter of seconds.

How can I govern this thing? =]

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Last edited by EppNation; 09-30-17 at 09:07 PM. Reason: link
 
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09-30-17, 09:37 PM   #2 (permalink)  
Start with the simple stuff. These things usually sit unused for a long time and the throttle shaft gets stuck. Check that, it may be stuck (if it sticks, it will be in the wide open position because that's where it goes when you shut it off). If the throttle shaft is free, then you'll have to check the static tension spring attached to the governor arm on top of the engine.


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09-30-17, 10:26 PM   #3 (permalink)  
You saw and read that old thread but did not post any pictures of your carb or governor setup.


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10-01-17, 03:26 PM   #4 (permalink)  
Cheese:
If you're referring to the throttle shaft thats attached to the governor linkage, then yes, it moves freely. There is no throttle lever. Maybe that's what I'm missing? The manufacturer diagrams are of no help, I'll post the relevant pages off of them.

PJmax:
Yes, I know, super not helpful of me. My equipment is exactly the same as what's pictured in the linked post. Just a little cleaner lol

Ok, so short and sweet backstory is I bought this thing in non-running condition. The PO had taken the carb off to service it and lost it, but assured me that the unit had very low hours on it. It was 3 degrees of friends, so I trusted it. Short time later, he found the carb and airbox and passed them along to me. Carb was in good shape as was airbox. However, there is a mysterious piece that I'm pretty sure goes to something else entirely cause I can't find anywhere it would install. The pics with the tape measure show the piece in question.

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10-01-17, 03:40 PM   #5 (permalink)  
manufacturer diagrams

Not exactly a match, but this is what my model comes up as

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10-01-17, 05:12 PM   #6 (permalink)  
The mystery piece looks to be a cooling shroud. I can't tell where it might go, perhaps under the carb over the cooling fins or.....???
If it belongs on this engine the two outer holes should line up with a pair of bolts/studs.


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10-01-17, 05:55 PM   #7 (permalink)  
Just found this thread

I definitely don't have that same spring that's specified and circled. Makes sense cause when I play with it manually while running that direction tames down the throttle. The manufacturer diagram is only for lever controlled throttles, doesn't look like there is one for fixed throttle application.

Any ideas on where to find that spring?? If I can't find it, I'm pretty sure a keyring and a zip tie make happen what needs to, but I'd rather have the correct part.

 
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10-01-17, 06:23 PM   #8 (permalink)  
Leave it to B&S to be incomplete AND inaccurate...

I based my outlook on the diagrams being incorrect based on how many things simply did not look like what I have in front of me. Did a search for the parts labeled "governor spring" which is 209 and 211 in illustration, and it looks like we have a winner!

Part # 695307 sure looks like my missing spring right?


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10-12-17, 05:43 AM   #9 (permalink)  
Update

Ok, for those of you still tuned in: news is not that of successful repair, not yet anyway.

While I was waiting for the spring (Part # 695307) to arrive I bumped into an old buddy at the hardware store and followed him back to his place nearby to catch up. He just so happened to have a gene of his sitting on the driveway and I recognized the facia of the briggs and strat motor immediately. I ask, he says he fussed with it a little bit but never got it working. It's been sitting outdoors uncovered on the side of the house for years, and likely not emptied of gas when last used.
Sure enough, it's the identical motor, same Nikki carb and all. It wasn't a Coleman Powermate, the brand was Wheelhouse, and boasted a brushless generator/alternator. Not having my tools on me, and knowing my buddy didn't have much for tools I told him I'd be happy to look at it in the future, but I need to see something on this one now. I remove the cover where governor lies and it is identical to mine. No additional spring in rear, and the one spring it does have (on the curve) was in the same place that mine was in.

**I'm going to break up these posts so that images stay accurate timeline/order of events**

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10-12-17, 06:06 AM   #10 (permalink)  
Next day

So this $7 part that was supposed to fix all my problems shows up the next day and I get to tinkering seeing what I can make of it.

I read in another thread that the procedure for initial governor setting was to loosen the nut that binds the bracket to the governor shaft and turn the shaft counter clockwise until it doesn't turn anymore and tighten the nut back. That the governor shaft should have almost 360* of rotation but come to a stop, and if you were able to spin it in either direction continuously then there is damage to the parts of the governor inside the engine requiring engine tear down.

I loosen the nut, and turn the shaft, but am only able to get about 165* (from 6 o'clock to about 11 o'clock) of spin from end to end of the available spin. I turn it all the way counter-clockwise and tighten the nut, and give it a go.
Result: same as before, as soon as I leave the full choke position (just one click towards run) and engine rpms go wild exceeding 4000, probably would have gone higher if I let it, but I turned it off right away.

So I try turning governor shaft all the way clockwise and tightening back to bracket. This results in too low RPM, I go back and try and back it off a tiny tiny bit, but anywhere I set the governor shaft that isn't 100% clock-wise results in flyway RPMs.

So I figure wth, let's see what this spring can do for me. It actually gave me a more desirable RPM, after leaving the choke position. There are 5 positions of the choke lever between RUN and CHOKE, in position #3 (right in the middle) with the additional spring that allegedly is not even a component to this setup I was actually able to get it to maintain an engine speed that gave me useable/safe/proper power!
I also turned the idle spring(?) on carb all the way in to steady the engine speed. Turned all the way in, it was keeping the throttle plate from closing too much. I was fluctuating between 3570 and 3640rpm, after butting that screw up against the throttle arm it stayed between 3590 and 3630rpm

Hz hovered at 61 but never below 60 and never higher than 61.5
Volts stayed above 125 but never higher than 127

This maintained for about 10min before I decided I should plug something in and put a load on to make sure it maintains.

**I'm going to break up these posts so that images stay accurate timeline/order of events**

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10-12-17, 06:20 AM   #11 (permalink)  
Even more

So I grab a vacuum and a drum heater (first things I came across that have considerable energy draw) and plug them into my jerry-rigged governed unit.

Turning on just the vacuum and the engine leveled off to a steady hum (it continued fluctuating just a tad even after running 10+ min, between the 3590 and 3630 rpm). I look at the tiny tack, and 3600! A steady 3600 at that! Hooray I thought =].

Checked the other readings on multimeter

Hz was still holding 60
Volts down to 117

Hmm, a 12 amp load shouldn't drop voltage that much. I wasn't even using an extension cord! lol

**I'm going to break up these posts so that images stay accurate timeline/order of events**

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10-12-17, 06:34 AM   #12 (permalink)  
Then I plug in the drum heater (stamped 1000W) and all the numeric statistics continued to drop =[

RPM 3520
Hz down to 58
Volts 113

So, I guess if I wanted to adjust and tweak my rig job depending on how much I have plugged in, I could. Although it would be impossible to adjust for peak draws of motors and intermittently used devices. So basically, it's not where it needs to be, but I think shows promise with these tests and what resulted. Right?

Also, forgot to mention. If I try to move the choke lever towards the RUN position, engine boggs down like it's going to die and quick. I click it back to the center position before it does, but it definitely would putter to a stop of I left it there. Turning it more towards full CHOKE reduces RPM and steadiness of RPM is lost, but it never gets close to dying.

I'm looking to tear down engine hopefully this weekend so I can get a good look at internal governor components. Hopefully whatever the issue is will be apparent as I don't quite know what to look for. I found the "repair manual" but it has very very little information (and very poor graphics/illustrations) on this apparant late model engine. Lots of information and clear images of actual engines for the early production models though!

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10-12-17, 09:32 PM   #13 (permalink)  
Sounds like your carburetor needs cleaning and your governor is now all out of whack. It's not something that is adjustable, it goes in one position and that's it. Loosen the clamp bolt and hold the carb to full throttle. While doing that, turn the governor shaft fully clockwise. Tighten the clamp bolt in this position. If it doesn't run properly at this position, you have other problems.


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10-14-17, 06:14 PM   #14 (permalink)  
thank you

When clamp bolt is loosened how much free spin is the governor shaft supposed to have?

To set the governor you say "hold the carb to full throttle" position, but that's where it sit's when at rest. Should I have to physically push and hold the throttle to wide open position when clamp bolt is loose? Cause currently, I do not.


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10-14-17, 07:56 PM   #15 (permalink)  
No, the spring should hold the throttle open as it is doing.
There shouldn't be a whole lot of rotation from the governor shaft. Maybe 45 or 50 degrees... just off the top of my head.


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10-15-17, 10:28 AM   #16 (permalink)  
Ok, sounds like my hardware is all in check then.

How could a carb be responsible for essentially redlining an engine that's supposed to have a fixed throttle?

 
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10-15-17, 07:16 PM   #17 (permalink)  
The carb isn't redlining it but you mentioned dying with the choke off and surging at other positions which is a carb restriction.


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