fuel choice


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Old 06-13-20, 07:10 AM
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fuel choice

Was forced to buy a new generator inverter this week. (Ryobi 2300VNM). The old unit became very hard to start. Even replaced the carb, but could not see spending anymore time, trouble (including getting hit in the jaw from recoil handle slipping from hand) and non-reliability. BTW the old unit was also a Ryobi 2200 unit. Almost identical.

I believe the main problem was that the fuel was very old, even tough it was treated. I also suspect it had an electrical problem.

But here here the question at hand. If I use non ethanol fuel how long should I expect it last in storage and will it help to use a stabilizer with it?

The problem with these gen- inverters is that they don't have fuel shut off valve to run out the carb of gasoline. And in my case the unit will be stored at my cabin for weeks or months without being used. It could be left there for the winter. Draining the fuel is not an easy maneuver although there is a carburetor valve to remove fuel from the bowl. But that does not burn off any residue that might gum up the works over time.
 
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Old 06-13-20, 07:22 AM
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Short term (2-3 months) it should be ok to leave as is. Longer term (over winter) you will be better to leave it drained.

You could tip the unit over to drain the fuel out of the tank and then run it dry. Yes, there will be residual fuel leftover but if you put stabilizer in it, run it, drain it, then run it dry I would think you would be in good shape.
 
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Old 06-13-20, 07:37 AM
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But does a fuel stabilizer do anything in non-ethanol fuel?
 
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Old 06-13-20, 08:23 AM
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Non-ethanol gasoline will still go bad. Fuel stabilizer extends life of non-ethanol gasoline as well.
Put fuel stabilizer in fresh fuel. It keeps fuel going going bad. Not make bad fuel good.

If you use the generator regularly, but won't be using for a season, the best way to store is fill the gas tank full with fresh gasoline mixed with fuel stabilizer. The idea is reduce surface area of gasoline to air contact.
Start the engine then close the fuel valve to use up any gasoline left in the carburetor. Small amount left inside will be ok.

If not going to be using generator for a long time, then drain the fuel tank all the way and use up fuel left in carburetor. Remove spark plug and put a small amount of light oil. Crank the engine fuel times to distribute oil in the cylinder.
 

Last edited by lambition; 06-13-20 at 09:30 AM.
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Old 06-13-20, 08:39 AM
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If you can access the fuel line you can put in a inline fuel shutoff valve, have them on my gen and snowblowers. I use the ball valve type but the plastic cheap ones work pretty well also.
 
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Old 06-13-20, 12:47 PM
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I use AVGAS. The best gasoline you can buy, AVGAS/100LL. You can get it at your local general aviation airport. It's expensive (about twice the price of auto gas) but it is highly refined, very stable and has a long shelf life, no stabilizer required. I run it in all my small engines near the end of the season and I just leave it in the machines through winter. AVGAS does not produce varnish even after sitting for very long periods and it contains no alcohol so it does not absorb moisture from the air. And, the lighter volatiles are refined out which are what evaporates out of auto gas making it harder to ignite as it ages. Old AVGAS starts and runs just as easy as fresh from the pump.

A couple warnings:

It's called 100LL... the LL stands for "low lead", the 100 is its octane rating. Yes, this is olde school gas that contains lead. If you get AVGAS on your hands it will evaporate away leaving a white, chalky residue. That is lead. Resist the urge to lick your fingers.

Because 100LL contains lead it should never be used in any engine that has oxygen sensors (a computer controlled, fuel injected engine like your car) or anything with a catalytic converter.
 
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Old 06-13-20, 01:07 PM
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OK, thanks guys. I'll use a stabilizer with non-ethanol

If not going to be using generator for a long time, then drain the fuel tank all the way and use up fuel left in carburetor. Remove spark plug and put a small amount of light oil. Crank the engine fuel times to distribute oil in the cylinder.
This is my preferred way of storing equipment. The point is with this machine there is no fuel cut off valve and no room to install one. But they claim by putting it in OFF-Storage mode it does cut off the fuel feed. Then you open a valve to drain the carb. I prefer to run an engine until the carb is out of gas. But I don't have this option on this machine.

PD, buying aviation gas is not a convenient way. Cost doesn't bother me, but just getting it is a special trip in itself. We do have a light plane airport near by but if I follow all the rules offered by the others I think I'll be OK.
 
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Old 06-13-20, 03:00 PM
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But they claim by putting it in OFF-Storage mode it does cut off the fuel feed.
Some generators have a big dial switch, which actually has choke, fuel off and engine off all built into the switch.
Sometimes if you move the switch to lightly before off position, it will shutoff the fuel, but not the engine.
 
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Old 06-13-20, 04:05 PM
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Yes I may try that trick.

So I went to buy non-ethanol gas this afternoon. But I thought I'd be smart and check the Internet as to who sells it. They tell me all gas stations within a 5 mile radius sells it. NOT. It took me 45 minutes to find a gas station that sells it. Then the line for it was 4 deep. And it cost 6.50n for 1 1/2 gallons!

Well this new unit is neat. It has Bluetooth application and an LED screen that tells you how many hours you have left be it at idle or using an appliance. Also an auto timer to shut off if you set it.

Gave old unit to Son-In-Law. He's very good with engines. Even he could not get the old one to start consistently or to idle smoothly when it started. Thinks he's going to deep six it.
 
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Old 06-13-20, 07:25 PM
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In my experience high heat and sunlight make gas go bad much faster. I've seen new gas go stale in 2 months in a mower that was kept in a field with a translucent gas tank. I've seen gas keep over a year in a tightly sealed container in a cool dark place. Larger amounts of gas last longer than small amounts, and full tanks last longer than partial tanks.
 
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Old 06-14-20, 04:05 AM
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The smaller Honda EU generators have the on/off switch incorporated into the fuel shutoff knob. I've seen many people open the case and install a dedicated fuel shutoff valve so they can run the fuel out of the carburetor. It's pretty simple to install but you have the choice of leaving the valve inside the case where you need to open it up to get to the shutoff or drill a couple holes in the pretty housing and install it so the valve is outside the case where it's more accessible.
 
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Old 06-14-20, 04:31 AM
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On the old unit I was going to do just that. On this new unit I'm going to try Lambition's suggestion.
One of the things that bother me with today's gas engine appliances is the lack of fuel valves and the fact that one must tip the item to drain the tank. Just try doing that without spilling gas all over the place. Also the ability to easily add oil. Without a special funnel it's all most impossible to add oil without making a mess. A little more thought into design would go a long way. But then again the designers are not interested in maintenance or ease of repair for DIY'ers. But yet, to avoid any law suits they devote many pages in the manual about not spilling gas and much to do about maintenance. All to protect them but not help the consumer. There are 6 pages out of 19 in the user manual that are devoted to safety and warnings. There are more stickers attached to the unit about safety than one can reasonably read. But the engine specs and capacity stickers are located in obscure places and exposed to the ground to get dirty and scrapped off.
 
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Old 06-14-20, 08:32 AM
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I feel your pain. I have a box full of custom funnels and tubes I've made for draining or adding oil. It's a shame you need to have MacGyver skills just to make the special tools needed to cleanly change oil.
 
 

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