Exterior Paint Problem


  #1  
Old 07-21-05, 07:52 AM
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Exterior Paint Problem

My husband and I built a new house (small new house) and are having trouble with the paint job in the exterior and the builder will not do anything about it. Here is the story in short order:

Siding is HardiPlank, was painted in April (supposedly twice) and there are areas where it looks like there is uneven coverage. The builder says it is "flashing" and that flashing is common. This week we met with a Porter Paint representative (the builder called him out we did not) and the Porter Paint guy said that is just the way the paint is. He said they have lots of trouble with their paint causing "flashing." When I go to the PPG website (Porter is part of PPG) the list "flashing" as a problem caused, in addition to other things, by uneven coating. We also visited two Porter Paint stores and a Sherwin Williams store and all the managers said that the "flashing" is a result of uneven coversage and putting another coat on will solve the situation.

The Porter paint rep said that there is no guarantee that another coat will solve the problem and thus our builder will not put another coat on. The Porter paint guy said that we could have someone else come out and put a flat paint on but it wouldn't last more than five years, however, we have since found out that the paint that is on the house is flat Porter Paint. We really believe the Porter paint guy is just covering with the builder because of business associations, however, aren't sure where to go from here. We have a complaint filed with BBB and will up date that complaint.

Does anyone have any expertese in this area?

Thanks in advance!!!!
 
  #2  
Old 07-21-05, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by momtwins
Does anyone have any expertese in this area?
You'll need to ask a more specific question
I mean, there's lots you mentioned here
What are you looking for?

Originally Posted by momtwins
We really believe the Porter paint guy is just covering with the builder because of business associations, however, aren't sure where to go from here.
If you are looking for the next step, I'm not sure this is the correct forum

If you are looking for the definition of flashing it is the sheen change or glossy spots, often found at laps

The cause could be painter technique or product, but often small amounts of flashing would be considered normal and unavoidable

A repaint is the only solution I know

I'm not sure anyone here can tell you if your flashing is normal or excessive without seeing it
 
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Old 07-21-05, 01:30 PM
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I know people will disagree with me, but I think you have exhausted plan "A". Time to move on to plan "B" or rather "C" for court

I would ask both the builder and the Porter rep to put their assessment in writing and have it notorized[If you need to, say you will cover any reasonable cost of the notorization]. If the rep will not I would go as high up the Porter chain of command as I could to find out why. Present your case in court and supply pictures of the job.Let the judge decide. What do you really have to lose.

I for one would like to hear the rep say that his product is so bad that 2 coats of flat paint on a new surface produces these unacceptable results.

Was this surface primed on site? Did it need to be?? Was the factory prime defective? Do you live where it is hot in April and did they paint in the sun


Why didn't the builder tell you before hand that flashing is common so you could decide if you wanted a common paint job or a good paint job? Can he show you other jobs where flashing is present? If not can he give you the names of the people where it flashed and he had to fix it?
 
  #4  
Old 07-21-05, 06:46 PM
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Uneven coverage is the most likely reason for the flashing. I've only painted a little hardi plank [mostly dog houses on brick homes] and never had any problems. I believe another coat applied properly [keep edges wet] should solve the problem. Every builder I have ever painted for would expect me to satyisfy the home owner. Don't really see why your builder won't. As far as I know all new homes are required to be covered by 1 yr warranty so the builder/painter should be made to come back and get it right. Wish you luck
 
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Old 07-27-05, 11:11 AM
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Saga Continues

Thanks for your replys to our problem. Since I last wrote we have had a Sherwin Williams rep visit our home and he says the same thing everyone else does and that the problem is uneven coverage. We were supposed to have another Porter Paint rep come to the house this morning, however, he did not show and when my husband called him he told my husband that he was not allowed to talk to him :mask: .

We have requested the notarized letter and of course I'm sure we won't get it because they think we will just give up. We have begun to prepare a letter to mail to the Porter paint higher ups and will see what happens from there.

Thanks for the input and any other advice will always be welcome.
 
  #6  
Old 07-27-05, 11:14 AM
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You may want to give them a link to this thread, and let then know millions are watching.
 
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Old 09-06-05, 09:18 AM
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Saga Continues

Well our saga continues. First we requested notarized letters and of course did not receive them--no surprise there. Then we sent a letter to the a Vice President at PPG and have not heard from him and it has been over a month and sent the same information back to the Better Business Bureau who is handling our complaint.

Now we have received a reply from the builder through the BBB. Basically it says that their position has not changed and consequently no additional action will be taken regarding repainting our home. As a post note, however, and strictly in the interest of customer relations, the builder is willing to contribute $250 towards any repainting of our home that we do (he won't be involved in it in any way it would be up to us to have it done and pay any additional costs). They are making this token "gift" because my husband made the comment that he would not go to court over a $400 paint job. We have not received any estimates as to how much it will cost and my husband just made that comment so they are assuming that we have someone to paint the house for $400 which we don't it was just a number my husband used.

We are now in the process of replying to the builder's letter through the BBB and letting them know that this is still not acceptable. I am also thinking about writing to PPG's Chairman of the Board letting them know that their Vice President did not respond to our inquiry.

Couple of questions for all of you. Can you give me a rough estimate as to how much a square foot one would expect to pay for one coat of exterior paint (I really think one coat is sufficient if done properly)? We are estimating that there is about 1,500 square foot on the house that needs repainting. Do you think we are being unreasonable in our requests and would you take the $250 and run with it.

Thanks for all your help!!!
 
  #8  
Old 09-06-05, 09:50 AM
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It is hard to give any kind of generic sq footage price on exterior. There are too many variables - landscaping, slopes/elevations,window placement,etc. It will probably take less the 5 gal of paint but it would be hard to give a labor estimate without walking around the house.
I would get a few estimates but continue to pursue getting the builder to rectify the problem. I would only take the $250 as a last resort. I assume accepting the money would relieve the builder of any further action on the paint job.
 
  #9  
Old 09-06-05, 09:53 AM
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So you're pretty sure it's not a paint defect then, it's a bad paint job
So that leaves the Paint Manufacturer out
It's not their fault a contractor didn't apply their product properly

The builder (painter) has said they will not do anything more, it's normal he says

It seems some people who have seen it say it's applied incorrectly
It looks like (sorry there's a lot of info here) a competing paint co. rep says it looks like it was applied incorrectly...that seems to be it

The BBB has no authority whatsoever, they generate their income by members who pay dues
If the builder is a member, theoretically the BBB brass has some pull, but they will not jeopardize the loss of dues from a paying member
They may put him on a list
If the builder is not a member the BBB has even less authority than none whatsoever

The BBB has negotiated a $250 settlement from the builder

You may negotiate slightly more through the BBB, but it will not be worth your time

I can't really give you proper advice, not knowing how bad this flashing is
It may be well worth taking the $250
However if it is really bad, there is no way $250, or $400 is going to pay for a paint job
It'll help, but....

Well you'll have to make a decision, either accept the $250 or don't and sue

If you do not accept the offer of $250 do not waste any more time with the BBB

Is there any way you can send me some pictures?
That might help
If it was obvious to the pro's here that you had a serious gripe it would be easier to say ditch the $250 and persue other routes with some teeth,
Or it really doesn't look to bad, $250 sounds like a good offer

Also: how much did you pay for the paint job?
 
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Old 09-06-05, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by marksr
I assume accepting the money would relieve the builder of any further action on the paint job.
You would be correct, the H/O would be req'd to sign a paper stating as much
 
  #11  
Old 09-06-05, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by marksr
... Every builder I have ever painted for would expect me to satyisfy the home owner. Don't really see why your builder won't.
This puzzles me also
This guy might be a real jerk, or the flashing may not be unreasonable
Originally Posted by marksr
As far as I know all new homes are required to be covered by 1 yr warranty so the builder/painter should be made to come back and get it right.
Which is another thing that puzzles me, it normally wouldn't break his bank to send out a painter for another coat on a side or two, or a few courses of siding
It might make him mad, but he'd just send a flunky and a ladder and a gallon of paint for a day
It might cost him...about $250
Hmmm...were have I seen that figure before? Hmmm...
 
  #12  
Old 09-08-05, 03:34 PM
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Some Pictures

Well I finally was able to take some pictures and they can be seen at:

www.housepaint.myphotoalbum.com

click on the picture on the left and it will take you to the album

We had one estimate today for $620 and expect to get another tomorrow.

Thanks for letting me know what you think about the pictures.
 
  #13  
Old 09-08-05, 04:24 PM
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Did the painter know how to spray? I'd be ashamed to collect on a job left like that. When spraying siding it helps to keep a wet edge which obviously wasn't done. Did he prime the siding. It almost looks as if too little paint was applied in the sun and not moving quick enough to keep a wet edge. The siding should have been primed and then the finish coat applied in a manner to minimize any lap marks [which appears to be the reason for the flashing]. I have had times where after spraying there would be a little of what you have but was always rectified by a thin coat of paint applied over the affected areas. Another coat of paint applied correctly should solve the problem.

Not everyone with white clothes, putty knife and brush who call himself a painter is one. Apparently your builders painter isn't.
 
  #14  
Old 09-08-05, 07:36 PM
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That is horrible
I think you should not accept the $250
I think the builder should pay for an actual paint job
That...paint job (?) is so bad on so many levels

I agree with marksr, another coat by a painter (a real painter) should solve the problem
Applied properly it would be no problem

I just can't believe a profesional (builder, paint rep...) said that's normal
Normal for an incredibly bad paint job maybe
I am truly at a loss for words

If you get 2 more estimates you'll get an idea of what it should cost to fix in your area (3 total)
If at all possible, please post them up before deciding what to do next
 
  #15  
Old 09-12-05, 04:29 PM
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We now have three quotes for repainting the sides of the house. One was $700, one $750 and another $800.

I think what we are going to do first is go back to the BBB and ask for $750 from the builder to have our home repainted. If they refuse then I guess we have a legal battle on our hands and will probably go to small claims court.

I hope the two of you don't mind me quoting you in my reply to the BBB. No names or the name of the forum just a retired painter from Tennessee and an independent contractor in CT.

Thanks if you would like to comment please feel freel to. Also would you like for me to post the name of our builder here in Ohio.

 
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Old 09-12-05, 06:12 PM
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You can defenitly quote me and I doubt that slickshift would mind either. Your pictures say a thousand words. Personally I would be embarrassed for anyone to know that I did a job like the 'paint' job on your house. I don't know if you did or not but did the painter bids state why the house needed repainting. Local support for your claim is probably worth more. Wish you luck
 
  #17  
Old 09-12-05, 06:47 PM
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Originally Posted by marksr
You can defenitly quote me and I doubt that slickshift would mind either.
Absolutely
I am a professional painter
You can give them my professional opinion
No problem

I had to look at the pics again
...I'm still speechless
 
  #18  
Old 09-13-05, 04:27 AM
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That is a pretty bad paint job.

You might be better off asking for $700 from your builder. If this ever goes to court, and you win your case, the most the judge will give you is the lowest estimate. Of course, that is not to say you should go with the lowest as it is not always better.

Good luck.
 
 

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