Cheaper Fuel

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  #1  
Old 10-09-02, 10:29 AM
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Cheaper Fuel

http://reuters.com/news_article.jhtm...toryID=1553167

After you check that link, please explain to me someone what this can do to an engine, if it is good only for Diesel fuel engines and what kind of exhaust would result. Thanks.

P.S. it's a short news article from the reuters site so fear not that it's some computer virus.
 
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  #2  
Old 10-09-02, 10:54 AM
Joe_F
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A guy I worked with talked about buying a diesel and doing the same thing. Back in 1980, his parents ran their diesel on #2 fuel oil.

It is only for diesels. I'm not sure all the diesels out there today would work properly on this . Fuel quality in a diesel is VERY important for it to be efficient and run right.
 
  #3  
Old 10-09-02, 10:57 AM
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#2 fuel oil

what's #2 fuel oil?
 
  #4  
Old 10-09-02, 10:58 AM
Joe_F
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Home heating oil, #2 grade. You cannot use it in anything but a diesel (reallly should use diesel fuel from a pump....diesel fuel may have additives for auto use) or your oil furnace at home.
 
  #5  
Old 10-09-02, 10:49 PM
knuckles
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Arrow

#2 fuel oil (home heating oil) is the same thing as #2 diesel. It is somewhat thicker than #1 diesel & has a higher sulfur content. It works just fine in most older diesels, however it is illegal to use home heating oil in a motor vehicle that is operated on public roads. There is no highway tax on home heating oil, whereas there is a signifigant tax on diesel fuel. Home heating oil contains a red dye to aid in detection/enforcement. You're in for a big fine if you get caught on the road w/ red fuel in your tank.
 
  #6  
Old 10-10-02, 05:20 AM
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Thumbs up wow knuckles

I'm impressed!! You seemed very informed. My question, not that it matters b/c I don't drive anything close to a diesel engine, who's going to know or see your red fuel? That would have to be mere chance and luck on the part of law enforcement. At $1.70 per gal. for some 89 Octane, I sure wish there was some cheaper, perhaps even illegal, fuel source I could substitute. Anyway, that's neither here nor there. Thanks as always guys.
 
  #7  
Old 10-10-02, 06:34 AM
Joe_F
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Read Knuckles post...contains a tracer dye.....

Barring that, depending on the vehicle, 89 octane is a waste of money in many cases. On many modern vehicles (excepting premium top end vehicles that require) it, using anything higher than 87 is an unnecessary expense.

Also, if you travel to NJ for any reason, fill up (I see you are in Brooklyn). I always fill up in NJ when I can...up to 20 cents per gallon cheaper (pays the bridge toll).
 
  #8  
Old 10-10-02, 04:10 PM
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Yeah, I know about the tracer dye but Johnny long arm would have to suspect something to even check for red dye in your automobile fuel. It's not like the exhaust will glow red or anything.

As for 87 Octane, is there a difference between brands? Like Sunoco, who claims to have plenty of detergents in their gasoline (which sounds like it would be more detrimental and toxic than anything even though they lay claim to the contrary) or a Getty where 87 octane would run me $1.49 per gal. I even seen a CitiGas that sold 87 for $1.01 per gal. yesterday! I think those brands have to be dirt. I use Hess because I think they're quite reputable and inexpensive. I'm also switching to 87 octane on the double!
 
  #9  
Old 10-10-02, 10:01 PM
knuckles
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enforcement

The red dye is used primarily to detect the presence of home heating oil in heavy trucks. Heavy trucks see relatively frequent roadside DOT inspections. The fuel is one of the 1st things checked.

The chances of anyone detecting red dye in a passenger car or light truck are pretty slim.
 
  #10  
Old 10-11-02, 03:51 AM
Joe_F
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I just use good quality fuel and change my filters regularly. No problems .

Depending on the vehicle, most do not need 87 octane.

If fuel costs are a concern, the bus or train is a better option
 
  #11  
Old 10-11-02, 09:43 AM
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Question Joe, you've lost me

Before you said that anything higher than 87 octane is an unecessary expense. Now you're saying that most do not need 87-is there something lower than 87 octane that people regularly use? Fuel costs are just a nuisance, I love the bus and the train and take them everyday, I only use my car for road trips and not to commute. My gripe is that fuel costs used to be a bit more reasonable and not too long ago either. A couple years ago, as I'm sure you recall, $1.29 here in NYC was more common place per gallon. But in short, gas costs aren't that much of a concern-I'm just trying to stay in "the loop". At any rate-I'm, glad I know that those DOT inspection stations check the fuel tanks-I won't try to short Uncle Sam on his cut.
 
  #12  
Old 10-11-02, 10:03 AM
Joe_F
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You're reading what I wrote wrong.

Most cars=87 octane is fine.
Premium cars, high peformance cars=89 octane and in most cases 91 or better.

Look in the owner's manual, see what they recommend. Try the lowest grade they specify (87 in most parts of the country, 85 in some other areas....). If there is no pinging, knocking or other issues, the grade of fuel is fine.

If not, step up one grade. If that solves your problem, it's either the brand of fuel or the grade.

You cannot buy anything lower than 87 octane (R+M method...research octane) in NY to my knowledge. Most of the 85 grade fuel is in other parts of the country. Again, follow the owner's manual guidelines in all cases.

Again, if taking a road trip, it's best to fuel up in states selling cheaper fuel. New Jersey is one of them. 4 miles from me in Linden, NJ the fuel is probably 20 cents cheaper a gallon. If I go shopping or visiting there, I fill up there.

Otherwise, I fill up (20 bucks usually holds me over for at least a week..sometimes a month in my 84 Olds 88) in NY.
 
  #13  
Old 10-11-02, 10:24 AM
Heavy_Equipment
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Bio Diesel uses the same idea as that first link. The Toronto Hydro Electric Commission uses a 20% blend in their fleet, but it will run straight if so desired. Using the vegetable oil will result in no loss of horse power or torque, with up to 70% less emissions than regular diesel. (depending on the blend)

The story about the testing period last year

Toronto Hydro's website
 
  #14  
Old 10-11-02, 11:34 AM
redneck
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Used to run that off road stuff in on road f250's--got caught due to large tank in bed of truck labeled "off road"--way too easy to fill up your truck w/ the red stuff when you got a tank full of it in your bed.

Buy sunoco--does not come from middle east.

Move to Michigan: plenty of work, great outdoors, $1.29 per gallon, no emissions testing!
 
  #15  
Old 10-11-02, 11:38 AM
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Redneck

I hear you, I'm on my way to Ann Arbor! Where does Sunoco get their stuff from if not the Middle East? Argentina?
 
  #16  
Old 10-13-02, 09:53 AM
Dan Meyer
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Here's the facts: #2 heating oil and #2 diesel fuel ARE the same thing with this exception: #2 diesel fuel is more highly filtered to take out contaminates. Plus, it has a centane improver in it. #1 diesel fuel is just kerosine. Many oil companies blend #2 heating oil to #2 diesel fuel quality. This saves costs (don't have to have two storage tanks, piping, shipping, etc). So when you buy #2 fuel oil you're actually getting #2 diesel fuel.
As far as gasoline, stay away from gas with ethanol in it (Sunoco, Marathon, Citgo, etc). Tests done by Ethyl Corp have shown that with 10% addition of ethanol you get a 15 - 20 % reduction in fuel mileage. Further, it can damage fuel system parts. Some auto companies specify in the owners manual NOT to use ethanol gas. I believe Ford does this.
 
  #17  
Old 10-13-02, 01:53 PM
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Dan Meyer

Where can I research more on this Ethanol stuff? So which gas stations have fuel that's without ethanol in it?
 
  #18  
Old 10-13-02, 04:27 PM
Joe_F
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www.google.com is about the best search engine for about anything...

Also fuel may be regionally blended to comply with regulations and requirements in the market it is sold in. Colorado Sunoco might not be the same as NJ Sunoco due to altitude.
 
  #19  
Old 10-14-02, 05:42 AM
Dan Meyer
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Federal law requires that any gasoline that has ethanol in it needs to be posted on the pump.
As JoeF pointed out, gasoline is regionally blended. The oil company I worked for blended for six regions four times a year. Warmer temps are more prone to vapor lock and so the gas has to be adjusted. Higher altitudes require a gas with a lower reid vapor pressure (lower air pressure also will cause vapor lock - liquids will boil at a lower temp at higher altitudes).
 
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