ATF useage but not dripping

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  #1  
Old 05-30-03, 12:22 PM
Deltadudey2k
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Unhappy ATF useage but not dripping

The transmission of my 93 Aerostar is usinf about apint of fluid each week. There are no spots in my garage nor where I park it each day. Who has an idea where it can be going?
Thanks deltadudey2k
 
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  #2  
Old 05-30-03, 03:48 PM
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Not sure if that tranny has a vacuum modulator or not, but that would be something to check. When they go it allows fluid to be sucked into the intake manifold.

Check the autolibrary link for info:

http://www.cybrrpartspro.com/Manual%...delLookup.html
 
  #3  
Old 05-30-03, 03:56 PM
Joe_F
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I agree.
 
  #4  
Old 06-02-03, 02:12 PM
Deltadudey2k
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Tranny fluid loss

I truly appreciate the instant answers. I checked the link as you suggested and it appears this vehicle does have a vacuum modulator. Appears to be a rather simple job, I'll know better when I climb under. You say the fluid is sucked into the intake manifold. Where does it go from there?
Thanks again for your help and advice.
deltadudey2k
 
  #5  
Old 06-02-03, 02:26 PM
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If it is sucked into the intake it gets burned inside the combustion chamber. You may see white smoke from the tailpipe also.
 
  #6  
Old 06-02-03, 02:53 PM
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That modulator is real easy to check, too. Just pull off the vacuum line and apply a slight suction to the modulator; you should get resistance if the diaphagm inside is intact.
 
  #7  
Old 06-03-03, 06:03 AM
Joe_F
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I agree.

Yamaha: You'll get GREY smoke when tranny fluid burns .
 
  #8  
Old 06-03-03, 07:42 AM
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Originally posted by Joe_F
I agree.

Yamaha: You'll get GREY smoke when tranny fluid burns .
Gotta disagree with you there Joe. ATF and Coolant will burn white exhaust.

Grey smoke can be black or blue.

Blue grey indicates oil burning.

grey to black indicates a rich condition.
 
  #9  
Old 06-03-03, 08:30 AM
Joe_F
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Depends on the "shade" of what we are talking about. ATF IS a petroleum product and would burn close in color to motor oil, which is blue/grey .
 
  #10  
Old 06-03-03, 12:54 PM
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The shade is white! LOL pour some atf down the carb and see how white it burns.
 
  #11  
Old 06-03-03, 01:13 PM
Joe_F
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I don't plan on doing that. White smoke in the pure sense of it all is coolant. Blue is oil. Grey is tranny fluid, black is soot/excess fuel.

Any of these coming out of the tailpipe is not a good sign . Either way, a gas analyzer can be used to determine WHAT is going out the back, which is the way I would go.

Original poster: Let us know if your modulator is the problem.
 
  #12  
Old 06-03-03, 01:27 PM
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Joe, Automatic transmission fluid does NOT burn grey. It burns white like a cloud in the sky.
 
  #13  
Old 06-03-03, 01:50 PM
Joe_F
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Grey/white. The smell is a better determination.

I have seen it burn grey .
 
  #14  
Old 06-03-03, 01:56 PM
Joe_F
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From Salem Auto, a well known radio and auto personality guy:

"Grey smoke can really be black or blue. You can usually tell which is it by the smell or by matching other symptoms you have to the color of the smoke is easier. Others will say blue is blue and all other is really grey to black and I would agree."

The smell is a dead giveaway. Antifreeze smells sweet and hangs in the air.

In any event, it is not good if it's coming out of the tailpipe! .
 
  #15  
Old 06-03-03, 04:55 PM
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http://www.salemboysauto.com/faqs/faq-38.htm

White smoke is either the transmission shift modulator is bad and allowing the engine to suck and burn transmission fluid (repair costs under $100) or itís really, really bad. White smoke could also be coolant or antifreeze that is either leaking, or being forced into the combustion chambers and being burned. The exhaust will look wet and have a sweet smell to it.

From the same article.
 
  #16  
Old 06-04-03, 05:19 AM
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Your turn, Joe. LOL
 
  #17  
Old 06-04-03, 06:21 AM
Deltadudey2k
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You Guys are great! I am going to be on the lookout for smoke this afternoon. I'll let you know the results tomorrow. Thanks Tow-Guy I will check the modulator as you suggested before I remove it. Another question, in addition to the fluid being burned, is it possible or probable that some would go into the oil pan? I truly appreciate all your help and advice. Deltadudey2k
 
  #18  
Old 06-04-03, 01:53 PM
Joe_F
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Mark also states that grey could be blue, white could be black, etc, etc. .

Again, I have seen grey smoke with tranny fluid. Who knows, the car was probably burning everything. LOL.

Let's see what the original poster has to state and if it's the problem or not .
 
  #19  
Old 06-05-03, 12:44 PM
Deltadudey2k
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Good afternoon Team: I have driven 113 miles. Set my right mirror so I could see if smoke is comming out exhaust. Also parked and watched for about 5 minutes. No smoke, no color of any kind. Inside tailpipe is black but not moist and does not rub off easily. A mystery but I bet all of you can help solve it. If the diaphragm in the modulator is leaking and the fluid is being sucked into the intake, the hose should have fluid in it, right? I am going to take the hose loose Saturday for a look. In the meantime should any of you have any other suggestions please continue to post them. Thanks for your help and interest. Deltadudey2k
 
  #20  
Old 06-05-03, 12:49 PM
Joe_F
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Change the modulator anyhow. Cheap insurance.
 
  #21  
Old 06-06-03, 05:07 AM
rredsoxsuk1918
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Joe ATF burns white in color. Engine oil appeares gray to blue.
 
  #22  
Old 06-06-03, 05:48 AM
Joe_F
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As I said, the vehicle we worked on burned EVERYTHING . It was all sorts of colors. LOL.
 
  #23  
Old 06-07-03, 12:36 PM
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DeltaDude..Usually, if the modulator is bad (diaphram leaks) you'll see fluid in the vaccum hose as you unplug it from the modulator valve..Usually enough to actually run/dribble out...As for where it goes, yes it get's mixed in with the air/fuel mixture and burnt by the engine..Will 1 get bad enough to get into the engine oil? Most likely you wouldn't be able to run the car, and the amount you'd be adding to the transmission would be quarts instead of pints..
Just an off chance.. have you check the radiator lately? Seen 1 or 2 cooler leak internally and never leave a trance...
As for what color smoke comes out the tail pipe...Wellllll everyone knows I'm color blind... LOL!
 
  #24  
Old 06-09-03, 09:59 AM
Deltadudey2k
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Hey Team:I just talked with a highly recommended local transmission shop. He said the cost to replace the vacuum monitor will be between $75 and $150.00. Said sometimes it is behind the catalytic converter. Cost will depend on the location, Is this reasonable?

Thanks to all of you for your great help!
Deltadudey2k
 
  #25  
Old 06-09-03, 08:26 PM
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I don't do any of the pricing at my shop, but last time I knew, a modulator valve ran $30-$40 (Joe would know better than me!)
Replacement time should be about 15-20 minutes..Some are held in place by a 10mm bolt, others actually screw into the transmission. They are usually located on the passanger side of the transmission, about 2/3d's way back. Yes the catalytic converter runs right beside it, 3-4 inches away.
$150 sounds kid of high to me..But it does depend on the cost of the part...
 
  #26  
Old 06-10-03, 09:24 AM
Joe_F
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You don't need a tranny shop to handle this. Any good shop can do it or you can probably handle it on your own. Autolibrary.org should have the R&R directions there.

MsArgent: Yes, modulators typically run under $50. Depends on the part # though .
 
  #27  
Old 06-10-03, 01:11 PM
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Originally posted by Joe_F
You don't need a tranny shop to handle this. Any good shop can do it or you can probably handle it on your own.

MsArgent: Yes, modulators typically run under $50. Depends on the part # though .
Reminds me of my '76 Riveria. The bearing would come part
way out of the back of the tranny case and rub against the governor gear. After the first one was destroyed and replaced, I grabbed all the TH400 governors I could find from the local junkyards and put them in a box in the trunk. I got good enough to the point when the tranny acted up, I just parked in a Burger King lot and changed it while I was having lunch. 2 minutes
under the car was all it took! Eventually that tranny was
rebuilt by AAMCO who did a great job with it!

Christopher
 
  #28  
Old 06-12-03, 08:49 AM
Deltadudey2k
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Thanks everybody Got the modulator and new hoses installed for $112.72 including tax. Also changed the oil. The little van is really running great, and I thank each of you for your truly great advice. This little jewel has only 458,000 miles, why do things wear out so rapidly. I'll be back next time I have an issue. Thanks again, Deltadudey2k
 
  #29  
Old 06-12-03, 08:56 AM
Joe_F
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There you go.
 
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