87 cutlass

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  #1  
Old 02-08-04, 07:46 PM
orfordbomb1
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Angry 87 cutlass

i have an 87 cutlass cierra that wont start. can any one help me?
 
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  #2  
Old 02-09-04, 02:43 AM
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Your going to have to do better than that with info. We don't have crystal balls. Engine size, symptoms, history, what have you checked..etc
 
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Old 02-09-04, 05:33 AM
orfordbomb1
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87 cutlass

its an 87 cutlass cierra with 3.8. history of bad fuel system and starters going bad. starter is new, so is fuel pump. but doesn't have spark. has new coil pack and all connections good. but still no spark. now what??
 
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Old 02-09-04, 03:54 PM
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When you turn the key on does the "check engine" light illuminate?
You need to also check for injector pulse with a noid light. If you don't have that either, check for battery power at the injectors and the coil with key on. If you have battery power and no pulse at either the coil or the injectors, it's likely a crank sensor. If the pulse is only missing from the coils, you may be looking at an ignition module problem.
 
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Old 02-09-04, 04:27 PM
orfordbomb1
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the fuel system is fine. i know its pumping fuel. the check engine light comes on. i don't know what a noid light is so i can't use that. if it is the module, where would i find the module. i'm not to experienced in working with coil packs. i know more about distributer caps.
 
  #6  
Old 02-09-04, 06:23 PM
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Your still going to have to test the injector wiring. A noid light is a little plastic light that you plug into an injector wire and it flashes if the signal is pulsing and it has power. You can pick one up at a parts store. The ignition module is under the coils but don't go changing anything until you diagnose it correctly.
 
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Old 02-10-04, 04:48 AM
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Check your wiring. I had one of these in the shop a few weeks ago and checked everything Desi suggested and still couldnt get it to run. I just happened to see a wire laying about by the battery that turned out to be a fusible link. When I moved the battery the wire was severed. Replaced the fusible link and the car fired right up. The owners son has already replaced the injector, the TPS and several other things without success. Give it a good looking at before you start throwing parts at it.
Hope this is helpful to ya,
Billy
 
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Old 02-19-04, 08:43 PM
orfordbomb1
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Exclamation

ok. i got the car running, but by the time it gets to temp. it dies, and looses spark. what could that be? the check engine light comes on and displays the code for the esc and esc knock sensor. we had a used coil and module that we switched it with and still no go. now what should i do?
 
  #9  
Old 02-20-04, 04:00 AM
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Is there any noise in the engine? If so the knock sensor is detecting that and retarding the timing 10 degrees to attempt to get rid of the knock. If not then the knock sensor is probably bad and is retarding the timing all of the time. Using used electronic parts is bad practice. Any time you do this you could be getting someone elses headache. We have enough poor quality, or just plain bad, new parts on the aftermarket. It almost sounds like you have a heat sink problem with the module.
Hope this helps ya,
Billy
 
  #10  
Old 02-20-04, 04:06 AM
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Components in the EST are the knock sensor, ignition module and ECM. I might start to suspect a poroblem with the ignition module but your going to have to confirm whether your losing spark, injector pulse or fuel pressure.
 
  #11  
Old 02-20-04, 05:40 AM
orfordbomb1
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i still have good fuel pressure and a pulse at the injectors. but i have no spark. is there a way to test the module in the car? what about the spark control? is there a way to test that? the code reader also says that the throttle pos. sensor has high voltage. does that mean i need a new tps or is there simply too much juice going to it because of bad wiring? do you think there could be a problem with the ecm? if so how would or could i check it out to see if its ok or not?
 
  #12  
Old 02-20-04, 04:24 PM
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Well, if your sure it's ONLY spark that your losing, things are starting to point at the Ignition module. The test you need to do now when it dies is locat the trigger wire for one of the coils and check it for grounding pulse when cranking. You may need a schematic ti locate the right wire. No pulse means bad module. To tell you the truth, high resistance in the coils is a major cause of damage to the modules so you may just want to go ahead and change both. Now be absolutely sure that you have injector pulse when this happens so we are getting the right diagnosis. No injector pulse would mean crank sensor instead.
 
  #13  
Old 02-23-04, 05:50 AM
orfordbomb1
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here is something wierd. we disconected all the sensors, then put them back in replacing the crank shaft sensor, cam shaft sensor, mass air flow sensor and just cleaning the knock sensor. we also replaced the starter, spark plugs and wires, all filters and changed the oil. now the car is fine. we had replaced every thing a while ago but it did not make a difference, the car still did not run right. last night the car ran til it got to about 160 degrees and died. but it started right back up and never died again. we have good injector pulse and the wires going to module from crank sensor were ohmed out and good. but now were even more confused because we did not do any thing but check a few wires and it seemes to have cured the car. it ran for over an hour and drove fine before we gave up, but it wont clear the codes. we are still getting a code for electronic spark timing, and lean exhaust. what do you think this means, these are the same codes we were getting all along and now for no reason the car is fine.
 
  #14  
Old 02-23-04, 05:57 AM
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try this...

...start the vehicle and take a long screw driver or extension and LIGHTLY tap on the crank sensor while it idling. if it so much as farts, replace it...they were terrible...that and the MAF sensor...you can also tap gently on them and if anything happens, replace it. MAF bad won't cause loss of spark tho...more likely the crank sensor. they are tricky to adjust...so post back if that's what you find
 
  #15  
Old 02-23-04, 04:31 PM
orfordbomb1
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ok but the maf, crank, and cam sensor are all new. just been replaced not even two weeks ago and same thing over and over again since the begining then suddenly its fine?? this car confusses me. but you probably know more than me so i will try tapping on the crank and maf sensors and see what happens.
 
  #16  
Old 02-24-04, 03:44 PM
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After all you have done if it's fixed by unplugging sensors you have a bad wire,ecm or poor terminal tension on one or more circuits.I would start by checking the circuits for est and o2 sensor.If you have a est code you most likely need a module,ecm or wire repair between the 2.The o2 sensor monitors the air fuel ratio and needs to be checked for the lean code.Do you have any exhaust leaks at the engine?The crank sensor could be bad also,I think on a car this old you may have more than one problem occuring.
 
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