Maintenance related

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  #1  
Old 04-05-05, 11:03 AM
Elizabethl
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Unhappy Maintenance related

I just did a tune-up on my 1995 Olds Cutlas Cruiser,And it ran great until we changed the fuel filter and fuel sending unit, now I can't keep it running, idles fine but as soon as I give it gas it bogs down and backfires and tries to die....I have a feeling that its running too rich now. How can I ajust this???
 
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  #2  
Old 04-05-05, 11:10 AM
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check to see if a wire or hose was knocked or left off, check the fitting's and the gas cap
 
  #3  
Old 04-05-05, 11:23 AM
Elizabethl
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Did all that......I think it was adjusted for poor fuel flow....I have had the car only 9 months, and seems like all the parts I have replaced have been factory issue.....if the flow was poor then, it should be excellent now, thats why I think its flooding out, flow is more than the car can handle now....how to adjust the flow???
 
  #4  
Old 04-05-05, 12:29 PM
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You can't actually adjust it w/o a few add-on hot rod parts or messing with the computer

Exactly what parts did you change for the tune-up and what brand or where did you buy the replacement parts?

Also which engine does this car have?
 
  #5  
Old 04-05-05, 12:37 PM
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it sounds like its starving for fuel suggest you check the fuel pump by doing a fuel pressure test if low check rubber hose or connection where fuel pump attaches to sending unit also check the fuel tank baffle to make sure its not loose.
 
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Old 04-05-05, 01:50 PM
Elizabethl
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Originally Posted by slickshift
You can't actually adjust it w/o a few add-on hot rod parts or messing with the computer

Exactly what parts did you change for the tune-up and what brand or where did you buy the replacement parts?

Also which engine does this car have?
All parts were purchased at O'reilleys or Autozone...3.1 liter...Spark plugs, wires, air filter, oil change/filter, fuel filter.....in that order, the fuel filter was incorrect so I had to exchange for the right part...when I went to do this it was post tune-up...car was in excellent running condition...when the guy changed the fuel filter, one of the rigid fuel lines on the sending unit broke.....this I had to replace as well.....when he had finished these two things,the car no longer ran right.
 

Last edited by Elizabethl; 04-05-05 at 02:11 PM.
  #7  
Old 04-05-05, 02:28 PM
Elizabethl
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Maintenance related

Originally Posted by bejay
it sounds like its starving for fuel suggest you check the fuel pump by doing a fuel pressure test if low check rubber hose or connection where fuel pump attaches to sending unit also check the fuel tank baffle to make sure its not loose.
Do you think its possible that when the fuel pump was re-installed that something went wrong???
 
  #8  
Old 04-05-05, 03:56 PM
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Interesting symptoms.

Car ran and (drove ?) great until the filter and pump unit were replaced. Now it acts like it is starving for gas. Did a shop perform this work? Some fuel pump units do not come with a strainer. Are you certain either a new strainer, or the old strainer was installed? A shop would not make this kind of mistake. If so, this could suggest a clog.

However, you said the engine backfired? Is that what you meant to say? I would not expect a starved engine to backfire. Did you actually drive the car for a few days before changing the fuel parts to verify the engine ran great?
 
  #9  
Old 04-05-05, 07:08 PM
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I'm still trying to figure out how they got to the spark plugs in the rear side of the engine lol

Originally Posted by Elizabethl
...car was in excellent running condition...when the guy changed the fuel filter, one of the rigid fuel lines on the sending unit broke.....this I had to replace as well.....when he had finished these two things,the car no longer ran right.
Was your old pump placed in a new sending unit?
The hard lines are actually to the sending unit, and technically the pump itself can be separated from the sending unit

This may seem like a lot of questions, but trying to get real specific will help
As Lug says it's a little odd

It's important to know if it drove OK after the tune-up, or just idled OK
If whoever did the tune-up pulled on the intake manifold to rotate the engine to get to the rear spark plugs...
It may not be the gas...
I'd check the routing of the spark plug wires
Make sure the plugs are all in properly
And look for an intake manifold or perhaps a vacuum leak
Maybe a vac. hose was knocked loose or was old and the tune-up activity broke/cracked it

You might want to have the codes pulled and check the fuel pressure at idle and when you "give it gas"
 
  #10  
Old 04-06-05, 05:34 AM
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you seem...

...confident that this occured at the point of filter/sending unit replacement. i'd start with fuel pressure and suspect it to be low based on your description. low pressure equals low volume and that will make it run lean...lean characteristics are stumble, stall, backfire, lack of power...all things you mentioned. if the pressure is ok...then a volume test is in order. at least 1 pint in 30 seconds.

on the coincidental side, those things were notorious for MAF sensor problems...but that could have been corrected in the past by conversion to what they call a "speed density" type of system...not something you can tell by looking at it as the MAF sensor will still be there and used, but only for intake air temp.

this all smacks of a fuel issue to me...
 
  #11  
Old 04-06-05, 07:32 AM
Elizabethl
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Originally Posted by slickshift
I'm still trying to figure out how they got to the spark plugs in the rear side of the engine lol



Was your old pump placed in a new sending unit?
The hard lines are actually to the sending unit, and technically the pump itself can be separated from the sending unit

This may seem like a lot of questions, but trying to get real specific will help
As Lug says it's a little odd

It's important to know if it drove OK after the tune-up, or just idled OK
If whoever did the tune-up pulled on the intake manifold to rotate the engine to get to the rear spark plugs...
It may not be the gas...
I'd check the routing of the spark plug wires
Make sure the plugs are all in properly
And look for an intake manifold or perhaps a vacuum leak
Maybe a vac. hose was knocked loose or was old and the tune-up activity broke/cracked it

You might want to have the codes pulled and check the fuel pressure at idle and when you "give it gas"
Yes the old pump was placed onto the new sending unit (wondering if he assembled the pump incorrectly) and yes a new strainer was installed with the sending unit, and yes the car drove wonderfully after the tune-up, before the fuel filter and sending unit replacement....actually the best its run since I've had the car. Already checked the plugs/wires...seems fine,checked all hoses and some were replaced with the PCV/T valves. He did not "rotate" or move the engine while replacing rear plugs....just cursed alot!!! Also he used two "elbows" and three "extensions" in the process....No he's not a professional....a friend of a friend...I could have done the work myself but was feeling lazy and didn't want to mess with it so I paid someone else to do it for me....STUPID to let someone I don't know work on my car when I could have done it all myself....probably would have avoided the whole sending unit thing.....instead of using a clip release for the fuel fittings he just yanked and yanked til he broke the rigid line........Also he had a very hard time re-installing the fuel tank (wondering if maybe a rigid line was pinched during this process...took him 3 hours just to get the tank re-installed, seemed to me like the tank wasn't in the right place when he was trying to strap it back in)and yes I observed the whole process....once the tank was strapped up he became confused as to which hose went where...I was wondering if they got crossed but he assured me that was not possible since they were varying sizes....maybe not a real "backfire" more like a backfire in the carb.....
 
  #12  
Old 04-06-05, 07:39 AM
Elizabethl
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Oh yeah....also replaced the thermostat during the tune-up process....which subsequently is now leaking as well...........
 
  #13  
Old 04-06-05, 08:13 AM
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again...

...sounds like fuel starvation and after hearing about the process gone thru, i'd lay odds that the problem is with the tank installation or possibly the pickup if the bottom of the tank was damaged or bent in any way.
 
  #14  
Old 04-06-05, 08:17 AM
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Do check the fuel pressure.

When the metal fuel line was replaced, it probably had to be bent to fit into the original shape. If these bends were not performed with a tubing bender, then you could have a kink in the metal line. That is the first place I would inspect for damage.
 
  #15  
Old 04-06-05, 09:02 AM
Elizabethl
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OK...the guy has taken my manual to study, and seems reluctant to come back over to finish the job (seems confused now too, which makes ME reluctant to let him work on my car again!!! )......spent every penny I had to fix his oops's......when all was done and the car seemed to not be right, he told me it was because the tank was empty and had air in the lines due to repair work and that if I filled the tank and drove the car around awhile it would get right...said I needed to purge the air from the system...which I did at 20 mph (idle speed was all it would do)...and we all know how that has turned out....now I have no money to take it to a shop so that leaves me doing it myself...no prob...except that now I have a completely full tank with nowhere to drain off the fuel (no container that large!) and no repair manual......Any of you guys Houston/Galveston based and willing to look at it for me???....and if not, can you walk me through the fuel pressure test?
 
  #16  
Old 04-06-05, 09:32 AM
Elizabethl
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CARGUYINVA.......yes he may have bent the bottom of the tank....I was scared to death that he would puncture it...he was using a crowbar, wedging it between the tank and the axle, because the tank wasn't going up high enough to fit the second strap onto it......that's why I was wondering if one of the rigid lines might have gotten pinched or collapsed....and if thats the case....will the manuf. of this part replace it without me having to pay again for a completely new one??? (its hard to return a part once its had fuel in it!)
 
  #17  
Old 04-06-05, 09:51 AM
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the bottom...

...of the sending unit when installed is right at the bottom of the tank...it's possible that it was damaged during installation attempts. the rigid portion of the lines at the top of the tank may also have been damaged...either or both would create the performance scenario you describe. it can only be verified by visual inspection or by a pressure/volume test. if a pressure/volume test indicates fuel starvation, then it's only logical to drop the tank and visually inspect for damage.

as for your part...it's been used and i know of no parts distributors that would take it back...it's not resellable. not good news, i know...good luck
 
  #18  
Old 04-06-05, 01:54 PM
Elizabethl
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Talking Thanxxx...

Re: '95 Olds Cutlas Cruiser--Just wanted to say thanx for your help......haven't gotten the prob fixed yet but your input has definitely helped....will let you know how it turns out! Oh yeah....I promise I won't let anymore @$$____'s work on my car anymore when I am capable of it myself !!!
 
  #19  
Old 04-06-05, 01:59 PM
Elizabethl
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Please.....

Please give me a walk-through instructional on the fuel pressure test....the guy kept my manual........
 
  #20  
Old 04-06-05, 03:05 PM
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Please use the reply button instead of starting a new post to keep all info together. It will help to solve your problem quicker.

I merged all your posts together

Thanks
 
  #21  
Old 04-07-05, 03:07 AM
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first off you will need a fuel pressure guage some parts stores may rent them out possibly,
if you cannot rent a guage it would probably be cheaper to take it to a shop to have it tested versus buying one.
there is a test port on the fuel rail of the engine that you can attach the pressure guage to and then you can read fuel pressure wich should be around 40 psi key on engine off and around 30 engine idling if this is ok you will have to put the car under a load wich is usually done while driving the vehicle and attaching the guage so you can read it while driving to see if pressure drops on acceleration.
If the pressure does drop or is low then you will have to drop the tank and inspect further and unless you see something obviously wrong would suggest replacing the pump.
 
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