Follow this dealer recommendation? or not?

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  #1  
Old 05-25-05, 04:30 PM
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Follow this dealer recommendation? or not?

Recently I had my vehicle in to the dealer for a repair. The service writer recommended that, based on the mileage, I also needed the throttle body and fuel injectors cleaned. When I asked why, he said that many people with this make started having problems with these items after 15,000 miles. I said "no, I'm following the manufacturer's maintenance schedule". Later, I checked the manufacturer's schedule, and this service isn't listed there at any mileage at all, either under the A or B schedules. So, I guess I'm wondering, were they just trying to sell me unneeded service, or would it be a good idea to follow their recommendation?

The vehicle is a 2002 Chrysler Voyager with a 3.3 V-6 and 19,500 miles.

Thanks....
 
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  #2  
Old 05-25-05, 08:26 PM
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i had it done to my 02 chevy and noticed the difference, but if it isint acting up i would see no need minr would sometimes stumble at a stop
 
  #3  
Old 05-25-05, 08:28 PM
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I can't say for sure if he was just trying to make a few extra dollars but if it is a known problem, I would think there woud be a TSB about it so you could try asking the service writer (some refer to them as salesmen) if there is a TSB you could see or ask him what the number of the TSB is and you could look it up on the net. If it was me, I wouldn't buy the service since you are not one of the people that is having a problem with it.

You would think that with only 19,500 miles and many people having a problem, they would provide the service for free. Thats the way it should be anyway.
 
  #4  
Old 05-26-05, 04:30 AM
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Although there are vehicles that could benefit, fuel injector cleaning is largely a profit-maker for the shop and I seriously doubt that your TB needed cleaning at that low mileage. Bravo for looking the info up on your maintenance schedule. I like Jeff's idea to ask the "salesman" to see a TSB (assuming the guy even knows what a TSB is). If "many" people have problems there would certainly be some documentation. Also wouldn't speak well for their product if it required such maintenance at that age and mileage.
 
  #5  
Old 05-26-05, 05:23 AM
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It's a line
It's easy money
There are maybe some (higher mileage) vehicles that it could help
It couldn't hurt
It's high profit
It's not in the "manufacturer's maintenance schedule"
Although for sure it's in the "Dealer's recommended maintenance schedule"
If "...many people with this make started having problems with these items after 15,000 miles" there would be a TSB on it
If that's true it's easy enough to check

PS If someone finds a TSB on this I'll apologize for saying it's a line
 
  #6  
Old 05-26-05, 05:44 AM
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it may be a line...

...but...the service advisor's job is to SELL work. those of us that are or have been technicians in a dealership appreciate what a good service advisor does for them. the key word being "good"...a good SA doesn't need to lie to a customer but suggestive selling is the way it works. have you ever been in a restaurant and had the server ask if you like to add a salad bar to your entree? of course you have...that's suggestive selling...and it works. does that make that server a rip off artist...no, it doesn't.

it really bugs me to see every technician and service advisor painted with the same brush...a person concerned only with getting over on someone and always trying to sell someone something they don't need. i realize that the particular service in question isn't part of any schedule...but it DOES have value and yes...it most definately is profitable. but...isn't that the goal for a business...to make money? yes...and some items offered are more profitable than others. doesn't matter whether you are looking for carpet to remodel your house or an oil change, there are choices that sales people have an affect on.

bottom line here...it pays to know your vehicle and be educated about what services are essential (high value), enhancing (some value...depends on the car and how it's operated), or just for looks (low value...MHO...again)

cheers all...
 
  #7  
Old 05-26-05, 06:43 AM
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I re-read the original post
My bad
The first time I read it I understood it to mean the SA said "I'm only following the manufacturer's schedule"
I mis-read that and apologize for that

"The service writer recommended that, based on the mileage, I also needed the throttle body and fuel injectors cleaned."
"Needed", no
But "suggested", well that's not a line, that's a suggestion

Thanks for pointing that out carguy
 
  #8  
Old 05-26-05, 06:50 AM
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OK, thanks gang. I understand suggested selling. That's why I declined. I also understand maintenance "on condition" (if it ain't broke don't fix it) -- which I suppose is why it's not in the manufacturer's schedule.

So I guess the consensus is I should wait until signs that it's needed. That would be running rough, correct? Anything else?
 
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Old 05-26-05, 08:40 AM
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Don't want to p.o. carguy because he's one of the good guys, but the problem with comparing an SA's suggestive selling with a waitress is that the average person knows exactly what a salad is, what a reasonable cost would be, and can make a logical & educated decision as to whether they want one or not (would you like fries with that?). Telling your average person that an automotive add-on service is suggested, such as fuel injector or throttle body cleaning, is a little different. I'm not saying it is all bad, but the key point is whether the service in question does actually have benefits on a given car and whether the poor customer actually understands what is being suggested. Suggesting replacing the idler and tensioner pulleys on a car with 50,000 miles on it that came in with a busted serpentine is good business; suggesting a fuel injection and throttle body cleaning on a car with less than 20,000 miles and no symptoms smells of profiteering. Also, there's an awful lot of people who wouldn't know suggestive selling if it bit them on the butt and think the SA is simply giving them sound advice. I can pretty much guarantee that I could sell a muffler bearing service to 50% of the average car owners (probably NOT skycat because I would see a post here asking if that was necessary) mainly because (a) it sounds important and they don't want it to "fail", (b) the SA is in somewhat of a position of authority and power, and (c) they don't want to appear ignorant to the SA ("I have no idea what you're talking about"). Agreed, that the car owner should educate himself enough to know these things, but that ain't gonna happen in most cases and very few people would do like skycat and ask an outside source for advice rather than just nodding their head to the SA since, well, they're already there. [Side note: the_tow_guy's younger brother and sister are pretty clueless on automotive matters - go figure - but at least my sister has learned to call me when the local quick lube place also suggests a cooling system flush, tranny flush, fuel injection cleaning, air filter replacement, new spark plugs, and God knows what else on her less than two year old car].

Not trying to slam SA's here; I know they're doing what the boss pays them to do.
 
  #10  
Old 05-27-05, 05:02 AM
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i knew what i was doing...

...when i hung my opinion out there for everyone to see and NO...i'm definately not PO'ed at TTG...or anyone else for that matter. My perspective simply comes from the fact that as a flat rate line technician for 13 years, I came to learn that what TTG is saying is exactly correct. so...if I had had to rely on just customers coming in and purchasing service, because of their general cluelessness, i'd have have never been able to afford a house or children...so...you're left with selling work. Keep in mind that my experience is mid size city...so people just weren't beating down the door for service. I think this is leading to building relationships with customers...good values and a sense of ethics are essential to long lasting work relationships.
 
  #11  
Old 05-27-05, 10:59 AM
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[TTG breathes a sigh of relief]. Afraid I was stepping a little heavy on some toes there.

What would really, REALLY be nice would be if service writers had to be qualified mechanics before they could become service "advisors". They could then actually advise customers more knowledgably. Many SA's are very knowledgeable, but unfortunately there are plenty out there who are more salesman than advisor.
 
  #12  
Old 05-27-05, 12:58 PM
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The recommended maintenence suggested (cleaning) is something you should probably do (yourself) every 80,000 - 100,000 miles.
 
  #13  
Old 05-27-05, 03:01 PM
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Thanks, icondude, for the answer!! Although, as a newbie here, it's kinda cool that my question started a lively thread!! LOL
 
  #14  
Old 05-27-05, 03:44 PM
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If this guy was trying to sell you an un-needed service, there's a chance he could have billed you for it without even having the work done and you would never know.
It's too bad that some unethical service advisors spoil it for the good ones. Too bad for the customers too, who may deny needed service because they don't trust the advisor.
 
  #15  
Old 05-27-05, 04:50 PM
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It depends on what the customer's level of expectations are.

For example, a customer is going on vacation, so they bring their minivan in for it's 15K service shortly before the trip. It is what they believe to be the appropriate thing to do before the trip. They also believe that anything that could go wrong with the vehicle has been inspected, cleaned, tweaked, or whatever, so the vehicle is now bullet proof.

The dealer service department maybe has records indicating that one injector in 10,000 may fail due to some sort of deposits on an injector that could be remedied by cleaning.

This might cause a rough idle, maybe the service engine soon light to come on.

Due you want this to happen to you? As you're sitting in traffic in 110 degree heat, on the 95 heading into NYC? With your offspring in the back seat?
 
  #16  
Old 05-28-05, 04:27 PM
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IF it was idling rough and the check engine light came on, sure.

But unscheduled, non-periodic preventative "just in case" service is just too expensive these days, and the engines are too complicated and too tight under the hood for the average diy'er.

Following the trend of practically everything else these days....next is the throw-away car. Use it until it quits, then get a new one.
 
  #17  
Old 05-30-05, 06:22 AM
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throw-away car

"next is the throw-away car. Use it until it quits, then get" something else. That would be a Chevy Sprint or it's Geo offspring.

I have one in my driveway. Anyone interested in converting it to an EV (Electric Vehicle)?
 
  #18  
Old 05-30-05, 06:44 AM
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Well, it sounds like you've answered your own question.
 
  #19  
Old 05-30-05, 07:41 AM
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Originally Posted by jeff67
If this guy was trying to sell you an un-needed service, there's a chance he could have billed you for it without even having the work done and you would never know. .
I stopped at a gas staion the other day and they offred gumout mixed in right at the pump for 2.95.

I got thinking about it if I pushed the button for the 2.95 add on how would I ever know it was in the gas ?

rather than the dealer service I would buy a bottle of gumout or another injector clener and run it thru every 6 months or so .
 
  #20  
Old 05-31-05, 05:31 AM
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Haven't seen that one yet, mango, but I'll bet they are going to make a LOT of money on the idea and that it'll start to show up at more places. $2.95 for maybe $.50 worth of product? Serious mark-up. Plus, as you suggest, how would you ever know if it's going in??? Going to have to start sitting up late at night to come up with some kind of snake-oil add-on gimmick for the towing business ("I can attach SAFETY chains for only $3.00 additional....").
 
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