chrysler rumbles

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  #1  
Old 04-01-09, 09:30 AM
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chrysler rumbles

I have a 2005 Chrysler Sebring and I am noticing a slight rumble when the car in in motion. I have had the car off the ground and in gear with the wheels off and I didn't notice anything out of order.

When driving it is apparent that something is grinding somewhere. I'm suspecting a wheel bearing or a CV drive shaft, or something in that area.

I know someone with a 2000 stratus who's car is making the similar sound. He hasn't had his fixed, so he's been driving on it for a year now. My question is whether anyone know's of any common problems with these chrysler cars?
 
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  #2  
Old 04-01-09, 10:11 AM
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What you describe sounds like a bad wheel bearing. It'll make noise long before it develops looseness in the bearing. Off the ground, unloaded, it can conceivably make no noise. I've seen a 2mm spall result in bearing noise that'll give you a migraine.

These things are tricky to diagnose, and I can't rule out some other component going bad. You may have to let it get worse before you can properly diagnose it.

BTW, our company manufactures the OEM whel bearings for this model and I handle the warranty that comes to our facility.
 
  #3  
Old 04-01-09, 11:25 AM
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thanks Kestas, while driving I think it is the right side but i'm not for sure. I appreciate the help, and I am going to try the wheel bearing.
 
  #4  
Old 04-01-09, 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by jugrnaut69 View Post
My question is whether anyone know's of any common problems with these chrysler cars?
For reasons like this, they put out SB's(service bulletins) on cars. You might look into that.

What Kestas said is news to me if true. I never heard that a wheel bearing can be faulty when there is no looseness in it. I've never personally ever had a wheel bearing failure that wasn't resulting in a loose bearing. And once, my wheel almost fell off, and I had to change out the bearing right then and there, in some strip mall parking lot 40 miles from home.

Do cars that have what I understand are non-serviceable hubs, that have the bearings in them, can cause such a symptom without the associated looseness?
 
  #5  
Old 04-01-09, 05:17 PM
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Ecman thanks for the input. I'm going to try and look for some service bulletins on the car. I'm going to google it, but do you know where I can find them as well?
 
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Old 04-01-09, 05:39 PM
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You could just call the dealership and they may tell you, if you speak to the service manager. I've got lots of good info from service managers over the years.

Or, if you want to search online, I know that Sam, from the "Sam's Garage" radio program is linked up with AllData, while he is on the air, and he checks out service bulletins for people calling in about their car problems. I don't know if you have to pay for that ability, though.
 
  #7  
Old 04-02-09, 01:25 AM
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drive the vehicle and try to sway the vehicle right and left and listen for a change of pitch in noise to isolate if its a wheel bearing and which side
 
  #8  
Old 04-02-09, 05:19 AM
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I've done that before, and the volume changes slightly. Not enough to isolate it really, i fugured it was changing due to body roll and the inside tire is having less weight on it. I'll do it again today and really ttry to hone in it.

BTW ECman I already have an Alldata accountvor this vehicle. I'll see if they might have something.
 
  #9  
Old 04-02-09, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by ecman51` View Post
... What Kestas said is news to me if true. I never heard that a wheel bearing can be faulty when there is no looseness in it. I've never personally ever had a wheel bearing failure that wasn't resulting in a loose bearing. And once, my wheel almost fell off, and I had to change out the bearing right then and there, in some strip mall parking lot 40 miles from home.

Do cars that have what I understand are non-serviceable hubs, that have the bearings in them, can cause such a symptom without the associated looseness?
This is because in your limited experience, the bearings were always far gone with sizeable spalls. I've taken apart and seen more spalled wheel hub units (and just about any other bearing) than any mechanic will see in his lifetime. These are wheel bearings that failed during warranty. Though a lot of them show advanced failure and associated looseness, there are also many that have spalled and don't show any looseness.

Like I said, it only takes a small spall to create noise, yet a small spall will not result in looseness.
 
  #10  
Old 04-02-09, 06:55 AM
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kestas,

Are these still the typical looking tapered needle bearings? If so, I'm trying to get a mental image as to what can cause the sound, yet no looseness. Could it be say that some needles have flat spots on just one side?, and as the needles spin inside the raceway, sometimes they are riding on the flat spot and jumping in the raceway(hence causing the rumble?), while other times they are riding on the still good part of the needle bearing?

BTW, I'm sure you have more experience. But I have dealt with these enough to even have the needles out of the raceway and successfully reinsert and grease them. Some things in life you do not need to do things 1000 times to have a fairly decent handle on how the item functions, and to actually retain sort of x-ray vision as to how the object looks like and works. Just had to point that out when you opened the post by saying "in your limited expereince", without knowing me or what I have done over the years. Albeit I did not realize bearings could rumble without the telltale sign of looseness -always figuring it was the looseness that causes the rumble.

UNLESS, if one actually can catch the bearing needles riding on a flat spot, that maybe then one WOULD find looseness? Otherwise what IS causing that sound? Just from a (or a few) needle(s) having a spall -what would cause the sound, technically. And a 'rumble', you would think, would be caused by something a little more severed than simply some sound generated because of a couple needles flopping around a little looser in the raceway, while yet the entire structure, taken as a whole, is not loose at all? Seems kind of strange.
 
  #11  
Old 04-02-09, 07:58 AM
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The sealed wheel hub units for passenger vehicles are typically ball rollers. They only use taper rollers (not "needles") in sealed units for the bigger pickup trucks. There are exceptions, but working from memory nearly all Chrysler passenger cars wheel bearings use ball rollers.

The flat spots you're talking about on taper rollers are rare. Though I've seen the rare few that are manufactured that way, a flat spot generally occurs when a roller slides under load instead of rolling, and only occurs during advanced failure, shortly before seizure. At that point the rollers are probably skewed.

Though you have an active imagination regarding flat spots and loose needles, experience with bearing manufacturing and failure patterns shows that that is an unlikely scenario.

From what I've seen, the number one failure mechanism for passenger car wheel bearings is corrosion-spalling of the races. The seal allows water to get into the bearing (for various reasons), compromises the lubricant, and initiates corrosion on the raceway. The poor lubrication and corrosive environment lead to premature spalling and failure of the bearing.

And though my statement on your experience may have been a bit disparaging and presumptious, your comment "I never heard that a wheel bearing can be faulty when there is no looseness in it" allowed me to make the presumption.
 

Last edited by Kestas; 04-02-09 at 08:17 AM.
  #12  
Old 04-02-09, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Kestas View Post
Though you have an active imagination regarding flat spots and loose needles, experience with bearing manufacturing and failure patterns shows that that is an unlikely scenario.
I was hoping to beat you back here and erase my post in time. No such luck. I was REALLY upset over things this morning regarding a possible severe family health issue, a real bad issue that cropped up in my rental business, and my work load, and tons of phone calls, and being sold the wrong thing this morning (right before I made the post) and having to turn right around and go back.

I know bearings pretty well, and like someone dislexic, or whatever, I don't know why - but I started thinking of u-joints. I was painting and suddenly it dawned on me what I posted and I said, "What the heck did I say THAT for?!, and why was that even in my head?"

Anyway, just forget it. I am quite familiar with the tapered roller bearings on front wheels. Ball bearings is something different that must have come along in more recent years, eh?.

The overactive imagination came from envisioning how spall can cause the rumble I guess. Ball bearings not rotating smoothly and jumping maybe?

Have a nice day.
 
  #13  
Old 04-02-09, 11:59 AM
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My remark probably didn't help things. I hope you get through this crunch of yours.

As a consumer, I miss the days of serviceable double tapers.
 
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