The mechanic must have done some trick?

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  #1  
Old 09-02-09, 02:58 PM
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The mechanic must have done some trick?

Had my lower ball joint replaced on Dodge Spirit. I read in Haynes manual to remove lower control arm and torsion bar.

I looked under the car, after I got the car back, and saw new ball joint, but all the old gook around the lower control arm bolt was still there. ???? The bill was just over $100, including the ball joint. To me that was cheap, considering all the work Haynes made the job out to be. But maybe he did something that took him minutes compared to hours? What?
 
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  #2  
Old 09-02-09, 04:25 PM
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lol. Hanyes showed the long way of doing things. you dont have to remove all that, just take the knuckle off and pop it out
 
  #3  
Old 09-02-09, 04:58 PM
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As with most late 80's and early 90's Front wheel drives....

The ball Joints themselves were not serviceable.. The entire Arm...complete with new BJ and bushings was installed..

As the market for individual components became greater, so did the availability...To the point that I do not believe a complete arm is even available anymore..

Haynes as well as others are for the most part, are Reprints of factory service info...Hence your confusion...
 
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Old 09-03-09, 06:02 AM
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Originally Posted by rednecksputter View Post
lol. Hanyes showed the long way of doing things. you dont have to remove all that, just take the knuckle off and pop it out
You mean basically that few inch chunk of metal, that is just sort of clamped on? And that is it? If so, why did they say to do all that other for? Do you run the risk of bending metal in the process of 'popping it out'? Have you personally done one of these on this particular type vehicle?
 

Last edited by ecman51; 09-03-09 at 06:26 AM.
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Old 09-03-09, 06:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Unclediezel View Post
As with most late 80's and early 90's Front wheel drives....

The ball Joints themselves were not serviceable.. The entire Arm...complete with new BJ and bushings was installed..

As the market for individual components became greater, so did the availability...To the point that I do not believe a complete arm is even available anymore..

Haynes as well as others are for the most part, are Reprints of factory service info...Hence your confusion...
Unc, I hate to say this, but I do not know what you are trying to say?

I don't know what you mean by 'not servicable'? Not serviceable as in - not replaceable? Then what do you make of what Rednecksputter said?

Then you said "as the market became greater, so did the availability". The availability of what?: The ball joint? The control arm assembly including the ball joint all in one unit? Why wouldn't this always have been available? Or are you thinking more of availability from junk yards? Or that as time went on, rather than the need for the entire control arm, auto parts stores(or the Dodge garage) made available just the ball joint for the car? If that was possilbe, why was not that always available if that method works? And why the Haynes spiel?

Regarding your last sentence, there really is no 'confusion'. I merely was wondering if there was an easier way.

Since you are a Chrysler mechanic, is Rednecksputter correct? Because that surely cuts lots of (Haynes suggested)work down to a bare minimum. Have you done one by Rednecksputter method? Like I said, on my car, I see no disturbance of the sandy greased gooked bolt(actually the head is covered in it) that holds the lower control arm on. Yet I see the new ball joint and new grease hanging at the bottom of it, and no damage to the new rubber boot otop of it.

I'm wondering if I could do one of these the next time, if so. Although, $120 today is not any real big expense, IMO.
 
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Old 09-03-09, 06:25 AM
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Duplicate erased.......................................
 
  #7  
Old 09-03-09, 01:08 PM
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what he means by non servicable is non greasable, there is no zyrk fitting on stock ball joints. and no i have not done a ball joint on that particular vehicle but i have on hundredes of others very similar to it. by popping it out i mean using a ball joint press and an impact and pressing it out.. sry if my wording got u mixed up
 
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Old 09-03-09, 01:11 PM
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oh and btw about you doing it yourself. Unless you have the right tools for the job, its gonna be very difficult for you. with the correct tools you probably can have it done in about an hour or so if you take your time
 
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Old 09-03-09, 01:37 PM
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Well, also...when some vehicles are put out..things like balljoints are riveted in..I know my '98 Dakota was. Initially I imagine the entire thing was replaced...but as more and more were on the road...they came out with a bolt in replacement.

Of course you had to grind or chisel off the old rivets to replace it. In a Dealer environment.it would probably work out cheaper to replace the whole durn thing.
 
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Old 09-03-09, 02:58 PM
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I meant Not serviceable as in Not replaceable.....

If you went into a chrysler dealership in 1990 with your brand new Spirit...and you needed a ball joint ...The entire lower control arm was replaced.....Most Ford products were the same way....

Somewhere around 94 or 95 , Moog parts developed an individual ball joint to replace the factory part. Cost efficient, since a BJ was 1/8 the price of a control arm.

The joints are actually a "Press -Fit " into the control arm......You can usually bang them out without too much effort.....But Banging them in is a no-no.

The tool Sputter refers to is a Big "C-Clamp" with adapters to fit the base and shell of the BJ. Google BJ and U joint service tools to get a picture.....once you see the tool it will all make sense.

Gunguy.....Those Rivets are chopped out....The new BJ comes with Nuts and bolts to put it back...We're just finishing a recall campaign on Dakota /Durango....and we just look at the arms....bolted in joint is sent home...riveted in joint is replaced.
 
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Old 09-03-09, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by rednecksputter View Post
what he means by non servicable is non greasable, there is no zyrk fitting on stock ball joints. and no i have not done a ball joint on that particular vehicle but i have on hundredes of others very similar to it. by popping it out i mean using a ball joint press and an impact and pressing it out.. sry if my wording got u mixed up

Mine had a zerk fitting. Unless that bj also had been once replaced. Were you able to press out the bj without taking off the control arm, as it appeared the mechanic did?

The 2 things that made me say to forget to DIY it was removal of lower control arm and torsion bar, and having to take the control arm to a machine shop to have them press it out.
 
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Old 09-03-09, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Gunguy45 View Post
Well, also...when some vehicles are put out..things like balljoints are riveted in..I know my '98 Dakota was. Initially I imagine the entire thing was replaced...but as more and more were on the road...they came out with a bolt in replacement.

Of course you had to grind or chisel off the old rivets to replace it. In a Dealer environment.it would probably work out cheaper to replace the whole durn thing.
My doors are welded on. Am afraid to leave door open in hard wind and have door fly open. My last Spirit I had to have the door welded back on.
 
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Old 09-03-09, 04:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Unclediezel View Post
I meant Not serviceable as in Not replaceable.....
That is what I kinda thought. But that sounded almost too unbelievable to me.

If you went into a chrysler dealership in 1990 with your brand new Spirit...and you needed a ball joint ...The entire lower control arm was replaced.....Most Ford products were the same way....
Figures. They got you coming and going.

Somewhere around 94 or 95 , Moog parts developed an individual ball joint to replace the factory part. Cost efficient, since a BJ was 1/8 the price of a control arm.
But not any more, it sounds like. Thank goodness.

The joints are actually a "Press -Fit " into the control arm......You can usually bang them out without too much effort.....But Banging them in is a no-no.
Okay. Got it.

The tool Sputter refers to is a Big "C-Clamp" with adapters to fit the base and shell of the BJ. Google BJ and U joint service tools to get a picture.....once you see the tool it will all make sense.
Or maybe these farm town mechanic guys can jimmy rig something with a c-clamp?
 
  #14  
Old 09-03-09, 05:07 PM
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Home made "REDNECK BJ TOOL" ----Absolutely....

I said you Shouldnt bang the Joint in....But I said Nothing about pounding the arm down onto the Joint

Like I said, It will make sense when you see a picture of the tool....Homemade adaptations are welcome

120 bucks is Cheap enough, so let the pros risk their knuckles...

.Figures. They got you coming and going. ....Not really, because if this were a brand new car, it was replaced under warranty. The only other issue would be collision damage, which would be handled by your insurance....

Once the cars were out of warranty, there was all the rage at the wrecking yards to procure used arms...which were likely in no better condition than the one you just removed....When that fact became a SAFETY issue.....(As well as an economic disaster for the parts manufacturers)..the replacement joints were developed and made available to the public.
 
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Old 09-03-09, 05:36 PM
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Some local guy was killed because they said his car veered off the road. In the middle of the day! Everytime I hear stuff like that I think of dozing off, a boozer, dropped cell phone, dropped hot cigarette, dodged critter and/ or........front end part that suddenly snapped. , even moreso.
 
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