Hydrogen Conversion

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  #1  
Old 01-04-13, 07:52 PM
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Hydrogen Conversion

Has anyone here successfully converted their gasoline powered car to hydrogen?
 
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  #2  
Old 01-04-13, 10:57 PM
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Be extraordinarily careful with putting H2 onto a car. The fuel tanks are very expensive and if you find something cheap, it's probably an expired tank or not rated for H2. Also, H2 has a tendency to leak from fittings that wouldn't leak most other gases. This is because H2 is a very small molecule and works its way out of most fittings to some extent.
Also understand that if you do get to the point of being able to inject H2 into the engine, you are going to have to completely remap the fuel injection and ignition. You might also have to reduce the compression ratio to prevent auto ignition. These are all major projects that will likely result in some burned/blown engines.
Sorry to be a downer but H2 is tricky and expensive to work with safely on a car.
Also, you'd be violating the Clean Air Act, see EPA Memo 1A prohibition against tampering.
 
  #3  
Old 01-06-13, 01:52 PM
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..... to redefine my question.

It is a vacuum supplied blend of Hydrogen-On-Demand (no storage tanks) into the intake before the throttle assembly mixing with the gasoline to assist in combustion. It's supposed to at least double your gas mileage and reduce emissions.

It's NOT a switch-over from gasoline to hydrogen.

So my question should be: Has anyone had any success with the Global Energy Devices Hydrogen conversion kits?
 
  #4  
Old 01-06-13, 02:35 PM
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I used to have a neighbor that did that to his ford work truck [300 cid 6 cyl] He claimed he got an extra 15 miles per tank full. He was proud of that but to me it seemed like a lot of work/expense for just a little gain. I don't know what kit he used..... and that was probably about 5 yrs ago.
 
  #5  
Old 01-06-13, 04:29 PM
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Yeah, an extra 15 miles per tank is nothing. I would like to see an extra 50 to 75 miles per tank
 
  #6  
Old 01-06-13, 09:56 PM
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Ohh, these things. I haven't worked with this particular model but have worked with a truck fleet that used a very similar device. We saw some increase in fuel economy, although it wasn't clear what the long term wear on the engine would be. You get a small increase in fuel economy because you are increasing the peak temperature and rate of combustion in the cylinder.
We definitely didn't see 25%+ improvement in fuel economy.
It also increased emissions which is why hydrogen generators are generally illegal to use. If they have an aftermarket cert from CARB or EPA, then it's ok.
 
  #7  
Old 01-30-13, 09:13 AM
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I also have a Ford PU with a 300 Six, I don't blame the guy for trying, ha ha ha very poor gas milage, about 13 mpg, at best.
 
  #8  
Old 01-30-13, 09:25 AM
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The big problem with a conversion from gas to hydrogen is the availability of fuel stops. One over the road trucking company worked with a network of stations from Chicago to North Dakota and converted/ordered many of their semis for natural gas. I would imagine that many local distribution sites may convert delivery trucks to hydrogen since they are local to hydrogen fuel sources.

Dick
 
  #9  
Old 02-01-13, 09:29 AM
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You can increase the peak temperature in the cylinder by removing the EGR system from the vehicle. The sole function of the EGR is to lower peak temperature for emissions.
 
  #10  
Old 02-01-13, 09:49 AM
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You can increase the peak temperature in the cylinder by removing the EGR system from the vehicle. The sole function of the EGR is to lower peak temperature for emissions.
The only kicker with that is when it comes to passing emmitions tests.

I had an old neighbor that was experimenting with a water system on his TDI jetta. He did get it working, but not 100% refined before he passed away. The last time I had talked to him about it, he was scratching 75MPG (UK gallon).
It's unfortunate that he didn't get to finish it. His son was not capable of continuing the project and ended up stripping the stuff out of the car and sold it.
 
  #11  
Old 02-01-13, 10:30 AM
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Why don't the big car companys install these simple MPG improvments? When I buy a new car, the first thing on my list is MPG numbers.
 
  #12  
Old 02-01-13, 10:52 AM
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Why don't the big car companys install these simple MPG improvments? When I buy a new car, the first thing on my list is MPG numbers.
The car companies aren't at the limits of what they can do for millage. They still have room to advance.
I also don't see Hydrogen as being a good solutions for all environments. You need to keep in mind, in North America alone, they need to accommodate California emissions, while still being able to accommodate extreme cold weather we see up here and even further north.

It's a hard dance to accommodate the government and North American consumers. Between both groups, we want performance, fuel millage and high emission standards. You can't have the best of all 3 and still afford it.
 
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Old 02-01-13, 11:01 AM
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It's a hard dance to accommodate the government and North American consumers. Between both groups, we want performance, fuel millage and high emission standards.
I think realistically, it's only been the government who's been asking for better mpg. As a whole, consumers have been asking for more power and the manufacturers have delivered. This is why the government has the CAFE standards, because they need to act in a manner which is based on the best interest of people as a whole when the people themselves do not make the same demand.
 
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Old 02-01-13, 11:57 AM
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I was thinking it may just be these MPG claims are way overrated. I would guess the big companys look into all these ideas.
 
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Old 02-01-13, 12:07 PM
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I was thinking it may just be these MPG claims are way overrated. I would guess the big companys look into all these ideas.
This all depends on your daily commute.
I save a fortune during the summer driving my summer car to work as at 8.1L per 100km vs. our van at 14L per 100km.

When I lived in town, this was pennies. Now that I live in the country, it's a few hundred a month, even with the car requiring premium fuel.
 
  #16  
Old 02-01-13, 02:42 PM
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I think some manufactures care more/less about mpg than others. I don't know if the other manufactures have it or not but Chrysler has mpg display on the dash of their trucks and jeeps BUT it always overstates the actual mpg. Maybe I'm just a cynic but I think it's programed that way on purpose to make the dumb consumer think he's getting better fuel mileage than he actually is.
 
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Old 02-01-13, 02:59 PM
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I think that's all manufacturers - I drive a Ford and it tells me what mileage I have gotten as an overall average since I bought it 17 months ago and that number is consistently 2 mpg above what I show on the spreadsheet I keep of gallons bought versus miles driven.
 
  #18  
Old 02-01-13, 03:08 PM
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Well at least they're consistent. The one in my jeep usually shows about 2 mpg more than what I get. Thankfully I do get several more miles to the gallon then that the gov't sticker on the window said.
 
  #19  
Old 02-01-13, 03:22 PM
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You can add Chevy to that list. My 2005 Malibu also shows about 2 to 3 MPG higher than the real values I get from calculating MPG with gas fill ups.
 
  #20  
Old 02-04-13, 09:57 AM
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For those of you who think the auto companies aren't doing what they can for fuel economy, how many of you work for the automotive industry? I do. I see an incredible amount of engineering effort aimed at increasing fuel economy.

Can fuel economy be increased?... sure it can... if you're prepared for cars that are even more complex and expensive than they are now.

If you think cars can be improved beyond where they are now, and that the engineers are missing out on certain technology, then contact them. They each have a place that takes in suggestions and passes them on to the departments that could handle them. The only ideas they will not entertain are perpetual motion devices.
 
  #21  
Old 02-04-13, 10:16 AM
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My 2012 Ford Fusion is bigger and heavier than my 1993 Ford Tempo and the engine is a little bigger as well (2.3 to 2.5). I also have one more gear on the Fusion (6M vs 5M). The engine is almost twice as powerful now (175 hp to 93) but my overall mileage is worse (32 to 28). I fully believe that 19 years of development into improving fuel economy would have created better mileage in my Fusion than my Tempo. What was done was to make the car more powerful and safer, which is what we as consumers demanded they do.

I'm saying the big areas of improvement are where the consumers have demanded, not that they were doing nothing about fuel economy. However, the government requires more fuel efficiency than consumers so I think part of the improvements we have seen in this area would not have occurred without that influence on them.
 
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