Bypass Passkey 3

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  #1  
Old 07-22-13, 01:11 PM
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Bypass Passkey 3

2003 Buick LeSabre, 3800 6 cyl., 68k miles

I'm trying to eliminate a possible reason why my car won't start. Let's say that I've conducted all necessary fuel and spark tests, and everything about the car seems fine, except it cranks but won't start. Hypothetically, if the only problem is a faulty Passkey 3 security system, should the car start and run if I jump across the starter to the solenoid with the key in the accessory position?
 
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  #2  
Old 07-22-13, 01:22 PM
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With the key in the acc position, the voltages to the ignition, injectors, etc is off.

You can crank it but it won't start.
 
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Old 07-22-13, 01:29 PM
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Thought so. I read this on another thread and it seemed looney, because of what you said. And, if I understand right, "On" position won't work either in my scenario, because Passkey 3 is active at "On." (assuming again that a faulty Passkey system is the problem) Correct?
 
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Old 07-22-13, 01:35 PM
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Check this thread and see if that helps.

How to Disable a GM Passkey System | eHow
 
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Old 07-22-13, 01:49 PM
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That link is not the correct procedure... Look in the owners manual under fuel and it will tell you how to reset..

The issue is the hall effect sensor in the ignition key tumbler... You can try some key tumbler lub... May help... I was so disgusted in my 03 alero that did it so often I added a resistor to the ignition and it by passed it... The dealer wanted over $900 to replace the ignition and I said forget that...

You can do several other methods but all the others are hokey imo and leavs the security light on the dash..

Your security light is on right?? What this does is shuts the fuel off....

I did this several years ago... Let me see if I can find the original article I followed...
 
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Old 07-22-13, 01:57 PM
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Here is the procedure I used... I found my wire at the control module..

Grand Am Passlock Security System Repair

I see this site updated the procedures and a solderless way also...

GM Passlock Security Fix

And for autos where the wire needs to be found behind the radio... Although this shows my car I found it at the module and did not go through this disassembly...

GM Passlock Security Fix
 
  #7  
Old 07-22-13, 04:57 PM
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Thank you lawrosa and goldstar. The procedure I use for relearn is Passkey3. The procedure in your link is PK2. The only difference is with PK3 you don't crank, just turn to on, and only need to cycle twice instead of three times.

I'm going around this problem with a remote start kit with PK bypass. It's my daughter's car and she wants remote start anyway. The kit should be here by Thurs.

I've got another issue with this car. Should I mention it here, or start a new thread?
 
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Old 07-22-13, 05:59 PM
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You're here now.......ask away
 
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Old 07-22-13, 07:10 PM
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Weird electrical issues are popping up. First, the parking lights stay on with the key turned off after being "On," and do not shut off without pressing the "P" button (parking lamps). Worse, they stay on with the key kept in the "On" position, and will not shut off, even when pressing the "P" button.
Also, just a few minutes ago I went to remove the parking lamp fuses (so I can perform tests without the parking lamps staying on and draining my battery). After unlocking the doors with the fob, I cannot open the rear back doors, or the front passenger front door from the outside! The only door I can open from the outside is the front driver door. I've not had this problem before. This happened with both fobs. Do I have a problem with a bad ground, or short, or maybe the BCM?
 
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Old 07-22-13, 07:16 PM
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On some door unlock systems............. the first press of the unlock button on the fob will only unlock the drivers door. A second push will unlock the rest. On some cars that is changeable...... maybe yours changed.

The parking lights staying on almost sound like the car is in a programming mode.
 
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Old 07-22-13, 07:50 PM
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yes... My spouses car does that... one hit driver door... two hits all doors...

Lights stay on is normal for like a minute or so.....

Is this a new car for you??????
 
  #12  
Old 07-23-13, 02:46 PM
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Just call me dumb as a fence post. I could have sworn that I was pressing the button twice. Anyway, when I went back to the car sure enough the doors opened with two clicks.

It's my daughter's car. She bought it three months ago. It was great for a while, then weird things started happening. One was intermittent start with security tell, which pointed to PK3.

Another problem was a battery drain, which I traced with amp test to the power seats (.20 draw). While still in the process of testing for drain, I put a 2 amp trickle charge on overnight, and then the next day the starter would not crank. Then I jumped from the solenoid to the starter and now it cranks, but won't run.

I have good pressure at the rail, good spark, good 5-volt system, good power and ground at the ICM (including good ground where the ICM meets with the mount). I have 12 volts at the positive side of the injector couplers, but no grounding when I crank the starter, and so no noid light. I'm guessing that all six injectors can't be bad at the same time, can they?.

And, oh yeah, I bought a cheap code scanner and it acts wacko on the LeSabre. It reads code fine on my other vehicles. On the LeSabre, the battery positive at the data port shows 12 volts, one ground pin shows 6 mvs, the other 16 mvs, and the bus positive line continuously fluctuates from .2 to .7 volts.

Several times I tried the PK3 relearn. The security tell doesn't show now, but I understand that PK3 could be screwed up more ways than one. So, although in my novice brain it doesn't look like the PK3, and seems to point to the PCM, my daughter wants remote start with bypass anyway, so what the heck, I'll put one on and see if the problem is PK3. Maybe in a way it is throwing parts at it, but I don't have sophistocated scan tools, and I've got to start somewhere. Anyway, I already bought the kit, so what's a father to do?
 
  #13  
Old 07-23-13, 04:56 PM
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Anyway, I already bought the kit, so what's a father to do?
Make the kids go out in cold winter and warm/start the car like we did... Oh that is if you have winters .....LOL
 
  #14  
Old 07-24-13, 05:41 PM
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Crud. I should have asked more questions before buying the remote start bypass kit. My bad!

On a lark I kept reading about Passkey 3. If what I found in Wiki.answers.(com) is true, I probably don't need a fix or bypass after all, but probably a PCM:

"Passkey III is not resistor-based. There is a rfid (radio-frequency id) chip in the black plastic head of the key....If the key is unrecognized or the ignition cylinder is turned without a key inserted (no rfid communication to theft deterrnet module) the PCM disables the starter and/or fuel pump."

My starter cranks and I have fuel pressure at the rail. So if the info above is correct, my problem is not with PK3, most likely (famous last words!)

What ticks me off is I read an info item weeks ago which stated that, when PK3 is activated, the signal from the PCM to ground at the injectors is deactivated, so the injectors will not fire.

My injector wire harness does not ground (noid light and Vmeter tests). And since the PCM governs this function, am I safe to assume the PCM is the real problem? Or are there additional Vmeter or other tests I can try?
 
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Old 07-24-13, 06:20 PM
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Passkey III is not resistor-based. There is a rfid (radio-frequency id) chip in the black plastic head of the key....If the key is unrecognized or the ignition cylinder is turned without a key inserted (no rfid communication to theft deterrnet module) the PCM disables the starter and/or fuel pump."

I believe hall effect sensor like I stated.... I dont think these things have changed... Its not resistor based so much but the repair is to show a constant ohms for the hall effect to start the car every-time....

My starter cranks and I have fuel pressure at the rail. So if the info above is correct, my problem is not with PK3, most likely (famous last words!)
From what I know you will have fuel pressure but it shuts down the injectors....

Dont fight it man....... Look at the obvious....

Is the security light on? Does it reset when you do the reset procedure???? You need to be systematic here and not all over the place.....
 
  #16  
Old 07-24-13, 07:15 PM
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Is the security light on?
No

Does it reset when you do the reset procedure????
I have no idea, because the car doesn't start, even after trying the procedure.

You need to be systematic here and not all over the place.....
The car started crapping out in so many areas nearly at once that, I'll admit I've been dazed because of the sheer number of problems.

However, it seems that Wiki is correct, the problem cannot be PK3 (again, most likely). I read the manual, finally, and it says when PK3 works, "the starter will not work and fuel will stop being delivered to the engine." It doesn't say that the injectors will not fire, which I formerly thought.

Just a reminder: the car would not start only after I used a trickle charger overnight. The next morning the car would not start. Does this point to one system or component over others?

Also, can someone please reply with a reason why the problem most likely would not be the PCM?

Thank you for your help. I greatly appreciate it!
 

Last edited by Broke it again; 07-24-13 at 07:37 PM.
  #17  
Old 07-24-13, 07:36 PM
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The problem could be the PCM but there is a logical order to follow before replacing it.

A PCM could be over 500.00 for that vehicle.

FYI..... the GM PK-3 is transponder based. There is a chip in the key that gets learned into the PCM.
 
  #18  
Old 07-24-13, 08:11 PM
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The problem could be the PCM but there is a logical order to follow before replacing it.
I've narrowed it down to injectors not firing.


A PCM could be over 500.00 for that vehicle.
I can get one that is programmed to my vin on eBay for under $100, 100% guaranteed, from a top seller with very high ratings.

What other components or systems govern the firing of injectors, other than the PCM?
 
  #19  
Old 07-24-13, 08:40 PM
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your talking passkey 3 and I am talking passlock....2003 car I have and you have....

I believe its pass lock issue not pass key...

I have chip in key too and it was unrelated.....
 
  #20  
Old 07-24-13, 10:05 PM
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Just to confirm it is not an issue with the key chip, do you have a spare key and did you try it?
 
  #21  
Old 07-25-13, 03:30 AM
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Just to confirm it is not an issue with the key chip, do you have a spare key and did you try it?
Yes. I tried both keys with the same results.
 
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