More problems or same one?

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  #1  
Old 07-15-19, 07:04 PM
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More problems or same one?

This morning car wouldn't start up. It would long crank but no start up. Tried it 3-4 times and finally it started up.

Then engine died after 1 minute when I came to a stop. It seemed to do that only when I slowed down or stopped but was fine if I drove it.

So in summary 1) it has trouble starting, barely makes it on after trying many times
2) when it is on, it seems to drive ok as long as I'm moving, but if I come to a stop or slow down to 5 km/h, it will die.


Some possible ideas it could be?
a) dying battery
b) low transmission fluid
c) corroding wires or connectors
anything else?
 
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  #2  
Old 07-15-19, 07:23 PM
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what type of vehicle is it?
 
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Old 07-15-19, 07:32 PM
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2001 Daewoo Matiz (AT) with 80,000 km
 
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Old 07-16-19, 02:28 AM
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It would long crank but no start up
You ruled out the battery issue, it seems to be cranking the engine.

Trans fluid would have nothing to do with it!

Terminals would seem to be ok since it;s cranking and did run!

Never seen one of these so really have no idea what it even has for an engine but would seem to be something else!
 
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Old 07-16-19, 03:39 AM
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How smooth does it run when it is running? does it miss or stumble? Does it idle at all or does it always shut off at low RPM? How low are the rpms when you are stopped?
 
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Old 07-16-19, 04:01 AM
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My son-in-law had one on these. Check for bad or corroded ground. Battery to starter might be good but other ground connections might not be.
 
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Old 07-16-19, 12:44 PM
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First, never hear of the car so I am not familiar with it.

I say its a fuel issue. Possibly a weak fuel pump or leaky fuel line or a vacuum leak.
Its not holding fuel when not running. Then when attempting to crank, its got to pump fuel back out of the tank (for example) to the engine, then it finally cranks. This is why its taking 3 or 4 times before it cranks.
Then when at an idle, its not pumping enough fuel to keep it running. Therefore it runs out of fuel.
On the other hand, I dont think a fuel pump that cant keep up at an idle, will pump fuel during the starting duration. So, I aint sure this is the cause but I still think its running out of fuel for some reason. Personally, I dont believe its an electrical issue unless its an electrical issue connected to a fuel related part like a electric choke, fuel pump etc.
It could be injectors, pump, an electrical issue related to a manual part. Its certainly not related to the transmission fluid or a dying battery.

I do have a question though. Once the vehicle is started & you drive down the street, come to a stop sign for example & the car dies, how fast does it die & how fast does it start back?
In other words, when it dies at the stop sign, does it spit & sputter & eventually die, or does it just die all at once with out any notice of trouble?
Once it dies at the stop sign, does it start back immediately when you attempt to start it or does it take 3 or 4 times before it starts? Would you say its starts immediately or does it take 10 seconds or 60 seconds of attempting to start?
 
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  #8  
Old 07-21-19, 11:41 PM
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Thank you guys for the responses. Sorry my response is late. I'm still dealing with the issue. So I'll try my best to clarify and answer the questions:

- the first time it wouldn't start up was in the early morning. I had to try 3 or 4 times (meaning turn the ignition key and it was cranking right away but the engine wouldn't start). I also don't think it's a fuel pump issue. It does make the clear audible sound when I turn the key half way and you can hear the fuel pump activating and the clicks in the fuse box. When it finally fired up after 3 or 4 tries, the engine started off weak (barely made it on) but after a minute of idling it seemed fine and I proceeded to drive slowly around town just to test it out before taking it out on the main streets. When I slowed down almost to a complete halt (at small intersection), that's when I heard the engine/exhaust just sputter out and then it shut off. When I tried to restart it, it didn't restart right away either...it took a couple more tries but it restarted and I was able to get back to my curb where I parked. I let it sit there idling for 3-4 minutes and then it sputtered out again and shut off. I left the car parked and went to use my other car to go to work.

-later in the afternoon when I came back home, I went to start up the problem car and it started up just fine like normal. It drove fine also during my testing and even when I slowed down and stopped, it didn't sputter out and shut off. So that was weird. I wondered if it had to do with the weather/temperature because it seems to not start on wet/damp weather conditions such as early mornings or rainy days, but it did start in the afternoons when the car had been sitting there in hot sun and weather for 8 hours. I wonder if that is connected or related to this issue or just coincidence.

-I took the car to my local private mechanic and they just hosed down the engine area to clean the oil that was around the seals and dripped down to oil pan....seems like an oil leak was coming out from somewhere so they wanted to just clean and hose it down, then told me to drive it a couple days and come back later so they can check and possibly find where the leak is coming from. I'm not sure even if the leak is related to this non-starting engine issue.

-the weather has been rainy and damp the past 2 days and coincidentally both those days, the car hasn't been able to start. I tried again this morning and still didn't start (3 days in a row now) but I will try later when I get home from work because the weather today has finally cleared up and it's dry and hot. I'll see if it miracuously starts up today and let you know).

-When the car was running before this happened, I would say that it ran fine for the 8,000 kms that I've driven it since I bought it back in Nov.2017. But obviously the car being 2001 and only 72,000 km on it, I did notice the car seemed to vibrate more than I'm used to when driving....especially when letting off the gas, there is some vibration. There used to be a noise if I drove the car over 120 km/h...not sure what it was but car was performing fine, just noticed a noise that would come from the engine area if I drove it over 120 km/h..but the noise would be less or quieter if I drove down to 80-90km/h....but I haven't heard anything for months since that time.

-other things I noticed: one day I had the parking brake on and forgot to release it. When I turned the car on and shifted into Drive mode and stepped on the gas, the car just shut off and died. I saw my parking brake was on still so I released it and the car drove fine. I wonder if that would tell tale anything...a sign? Most cars I know of, even with the parking brake on, would still be able to drive without the engine just shutting off. Either this car has some automatic setting that would cut off the engine if the parking brake was on and tried to drive, OR it means something else...maybe the engine is not strong enough or not enough air/fuel/power to move the car with the brake on so it just shuts off? Again, not sure if that is related to this non-starting issue.

-lastly one time I was coming off the highway and when I stopped at the bottom to make a left turn, the car suddenly lost power when I tried to accelerate. I heard the rpms / engine revving up when I stepped on the gas but the car wasn't moving faster...it was just really slow, almost powerless.....but the engine was still revving if I stepped on the gas......that happened only one time and luckily I was already near home so I just had to drive really slowly with very little power and park it. Few hours later I went to try the car and test drove it around town and it worked just fine! It never happened again after that.

I don't know if all these signs are connected and related or if they are separate issues with my currrent non-starting issue. But I'm hoping some of you experienced members might be able to piece together these clues and help me narrow down what the problem with the car is.

Spark plug / coils ? Bad distributor cap? I don't know much else about the car.
Oil level is good. Sorry, I don't know what a corroded ground is and where I can find that? Can you help me? It sounds like if I can just find that part, I can clean it up and see if that was issue.

Yes, I don't think it's a low transmission fluid issue or a bad battery.
 
  #9  
Old 07-22-19, 04:37 AM
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UPDATE:

This should be huge. In the morning it didn't start up (as it hadn't for the past 2 days) but I noticed it never starts up (only cranks) in wet/damp conditions/weather. The 3 times it did start up like normal were during hot and dry weather conditions. So today was nice and hot and dry, after I came home from work, I went over to the car and tried to start it up and lo and behold it started like normal!

So I believe there is a huge clue here. It works when the conditions are hot and dry but it doesn't work in the mornings and in wet damp weather conditions.

Moisture is doing something here but I don't know what and where?

Anyone got a hint? I hope this clue helps big time because I think it does but I just don't know the technical knowledge enough to know specifically what part it's affecting.
 
  #10  
Old 07-22-19, 04:45 AM
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You have several issues with that car. Most are not associated with your hard starting & dying issue.

I still feel like its a fuel related issue. It could be a fuel/air mixture issue. This will certainly make it hard to start & will also cause it to die at low idle or stop sign etc. Possibly a sticking automatic choke since it doesn't seem to happen every time.
Since you have so many unrelated issues, its going to take a hands on approach to resolve this issue I think. Hopefully, your mechanic will get this issue worked out for you.
 
  #11  
Old 07-22-19, 05:38 PM
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Thanks for the reply. I'm almost 90% certain now that the starting issue was due to breaking down of secondary ignition system (spark plugs, wires, distributor cap, rotor, or ignition coil or ALL). The reason is that it only had non-starting issue during mornings or wet/high moisture weather. The fact that it turned on without a problem during hot dry weather and runs just fine seems to me that it's a secondary ignition system problem.

I have it in the shop now and they are going to check it, give me an estimate on what it might cost to replace the parts and I'll decide what to do. I'd prefer to get the parts changed if it doesn't cost too much compared to the value of the car. If it's a lot of money (say over $300-$500) I think I better just get another used car and see if I can get a little bit of trade in value for it.
 
  #12  
Old 07-23-19, 06:08 AM
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1. fix oil leak. You will not get far with oil dripping and seeping onto spark plugs. Normally, it's just valve cover gasket and spark plug tubes seals
2. my opinion, you have leaking injectors. reason being, it refuses to start when cold. that tends to condensate fuel vapor on spark plugs and foul the spark.
 
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  #13  
Old 07-23-19, 08:36 PM
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thank you for that advice....will bring that up with the mechanic....
 
  #14  
Old 07-24-19, 12:12 AM
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Alright ladies and gentlemen, got the update just now on my phone from the shop.
Mind you everything is in a foreign language so that's part of the biggest problems dealing with mechanics here.

Even though I told them to just check and tell me what needs to be fixed and an estimate before doing anything, they didn't
listen. They had my car there for 2 days. Finally today I got a text message and they sent me a photo of the bill.

I translated it into english so this is what it apparently said:

$40 for parts
$105 for labor
total + taxes came out to $160 (currency here would translate to about 110 pounds).

They changed the rocker gasket (don't know what that is but I assume that is for the oil leak around the engine)
Plug wiring, spark plug (3), and locker gasket (again, don't know what that is but probably for the oil leak around the engine).

The spark plugs were only 5 bucks each (15 bucks total), plug wires were 15 and locker gasket was 10.

Labor seems to be bit high for what they had to do...but all in all, 160 bucks is fine with me if this solves the morning non-start issue
and I can drive this car for at least a little longer (1 year hopefully or equivalent to 6000 km which is all I drive per year).

I'll be picking it up tonight after work and drive it everyday to work starting tomorrow so we'll see how it goes.

Any comments?
 
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Old 07-24-19, 02:45 AM
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rocker gasket would likely be the valve cover gasket. The rocker arms are inside that cover.

What is the going rate per hour for mechanics where you live? I would consider the labor bill cheap here in the USA.
 
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  #16  
Old 07-24-19, 05:07 PM
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update: thanks again to everyone for your feedback. It's always a learning experience gained. The good news so far seems to be the problem has been fixed. I picked up the car last night and it started up fine even though it was a damp day. It rained a lot over night and this morning I went to start the car to take it to work and it started up just fine.

So my take from this would be to any else in the future having similar symptoms: if the car has problems starting up during wet/damp/rainy weather or even just the mornings because moisture is higher, and you get a long crank (the engine turns over, but doesn't start), but it has no problems starting during hot dry weather, then it looks like it's a plugs/plug wires issue. The key thing I got from a post in another page was that when secondary ignition system like spark plugs and wires start getting older/breaking down, they are very sensitive to moisture.

Does anyone know what OBDII port reader I need for the 2001 Daewoo Matiz? I have an ELM327 OBDII mini port reader (bluetooth) but it didn't fit this car. It has the same 16 pins but the shape of the device is trapezoid whereas the matiz shape is a rectangle.

Maybe it would be good for me to invest in an OBDII reader for this car.

Sorry, I don't know what the hourly rate for labor for mechanics is here. I'm not really familiar with what is cheap or expensive but I thought I'd mention what I paid for what work got done and see if it was reasonable or fishy.
 
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