definition/cost

Reply

  #1  
Old 07-16-02, 03:59 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: MD
Posts: 2,079
definition/cost

hello again
my daughter has a 1999 vw passat. she was told her heat shield was damaged by something kicking up under her car on the hiway and is going in for repairs-i looked underneath and all i saw was that firm plastic under cover like a protective apron that guards the parts under the front of the carthat was pulled loose and damaged by being dragged under the car
i thought the heat shield (s) =the tinny metal that encases the cat-converter and other hot parts of the exhaust. i feel in either case neither is something that stops the car from runnung altho a repair should be made. if it is what i think it is a solid vinyl/rubber apron or protective piece(!what is that thing called??) it is put on easily with about half dozen screws. if it's the heat shield(not the one in the engine compartement that protects the manifold from the hoses etc) it doesn't need to be replaced but if it is it should not involve the entire manifold to tailpipe oiece and not even a new converter.
ANYWAY i'm afraid the vw dealer is going to clean her out so do you have any ideas that might help?? one bad thing is her hubby will only go to the dealer-i know but i've tried to tell him.
suggestions i can bring her qapptreciated and if aball park figure could accompany it would really help as aframe of reference.
once again thanx for listening
peterr
 
Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 07-16-02, 10:18 PM
Joe_F
Visiting Guest
Posts: n/a
The plastic thing is a splash shield and prevents road dirt from soaking the alternator, and belts and keeps things from getting ugly under there. As you've alluded to, it should be changed.

Ask the VW dealer to clarify WHAT shield, WHERE it is, and WHAT it does. Then let us know.

If it's like my sister's 2000 Jetta, that stupid shield comes out with a few Torx screws and has to come off to access the oil filter. I know, I've had to do it

Only VW could dream up a 19mm drain plug. Lol.
 
  #3  
Old 07-17-02, 06:21 AM
the_tow_guy's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: SW Fla USA
Posts: 11,477
I hope he has a good income if he takes everything to the dealer. He'll be paying a premium price for both parts AND labor, especially parts since dealers are required to install ONLY oem factory parts (at a substantial mark-up). Gates, for instance, makes very good timing belts at a fraction the cost of a genuine factory belt, but you can't get one installed at a dealership. Gotta love those $50 oil changes! There are some things that do need to go to a dealership, but probably 95% of routine repairs can be done just as well, if not better, at a good independent shop. And the one advantage the independents have is when you go there, you get to talk directly to the owner/manager and often the exact technician working on your car if there are any questions (which is often the owner himself. At dealerships, you rarely get to talk to anyone but the service writer (who may or may not be a qualified mechanic) and the cashier.

But I'm sure I'm preaching to the choir, peter, so enough on that subject.
 
  #4  
Old 07-17-02, 12:10 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: MD
Posts: 2,079
SPLASH SHIELD

thanx again for your advice which a i am pasing along to my daughter . it will i'm sure fall on attentive ears.
have a good one
peterr
 
  #5  
Old 07-17-02, 01:09 PM
mako's Avatar
Member
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Wake Forest
Posts: 455
Gotta love those $50 oil changes!
Holy moses! Every dealer round here that I know of charge $20-$25, $30 max, but that includes free top off of all fluids and new washer blades.
 
  #6  
Old 07-17-02, 01:23 PM
Joe_F
Visiting Guest
Posts: n/a
From what I recall, VW covers maintenance for the car for 2 years. I know that's what it was with my sister's Jetta.

However, the dealer was quite far in NJ and guess who wound up doing the oil changes when he went for a visit ?
 
  #7  
Old 07-17-02, 04:27 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: MD
Posts: 2,079
warranty

hi joe
let's hope the warranty covers this damage which may have been caused by debris on the raod -will let you know!
peterr
 
  #8  
Old 07-19-02, 09:52 AM
Joe_F
Visiting Guest
Posts: n/a
Ummm, not likely.

VW is going to consider that driver error (especially on a 3 year old car). If it were brand new, they would probably cover it...as a goodwill gesture or they could pass it off as a factory oversight...but not on a 3 year old car. You could certainly try, but my guess is they won't cover anything.

Again, find out WHAT shield and WHERE and WHAT its function is. Then let us know.

My mother's friend at work "ripped out the front" as my mother told me. Upon me asking further details, it sounds like the bumper cover of this 1999 Civic. What a mess . I have to see if I can fix it for this lady.
 
  #9  
Old 07-19-02, 01:11 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: MD
Posts: 2,079
belly pan

hi joe
this is what vw told my daughter is on order(their name for the shield i guess) and will be replaced tuesday-she did not ask the cost or did not want to worry me.
i wish i could have gotten a generic pan and put it on myself -
what does oem mean,i have forgotten-it is something like "original manufactureres stuff" but i can't get the acronym right.
i'll guess the part is 250 and double it for labor =500$ -that's a lot of iuce cream.
we should all boycott or at least expose them.
guess what when she walked in last night she told usan elderly lady slightly rear ended her so here we go again-if you have be in an accident it's better to be in the front car.-this incident will be insurance covered.
talk again
peterr
 
  #10  
Old 07-19-02, 04:23 PM
Joe_F
Visiting Guest
Posts: n/a
I'm assuming they still mean the splash shield up front.


500 bucks to change that is a lot of greenbacks. Ask for a detail o the part and labor and tell us what it says. Gotta be more than a splash shield and install for 500 bucks!

OEM=Original Equipment Manufacturer.

You won't find a VW in my driveway. I won't pay for Becks and get Corona (German company building cars in Mexico and charging German premium prices). Nor will I ask for Brotenwurst and get Taco Bell and be charged for the former My sister has a 2000 Jetta...a lot of nagging problems in the past 2 years.

Find out more, something doesn't seem right.....
 
  #11  
Old 07-19-02, 04:32 PM
otter_
Visiting Guest
Posts: n/a
to tow_guy..

Nothing in our franchise agreement that says we must install OEM parts only. OEM does make sense from a warranty/quality/compatibility standpoint most of the time. However, if a customer requests jobber parts, we'll oblige unless they ask for "autozone" (Canadian Tire up here) crap.

In fact, most maintenance parts (oil and air filters, spark plugs, brake pads) are competatively priced when compared to jobber items of like quality.

Unfortunately, I have to agree that the customer does get hosed on captive parts (parts that no jobber mfgs). Mfg will price those sky high because there's no competition.

My 2 cents.
 
  #12  
Old 07-21-02, 12:51 PM
the_tow_guy's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: SW Fla USA
Posts: 11,477
Must be slightly different operations and pricing in the frozen north, otter. Best of my knowledge if you go into a local dealer for say a new clutch they are going to use oem stuff regardless of your preference for lower cost parts from CarQuest, NAPA, AutoZone, etc. Hate to quote unnamed sources and unfortunately this is couple of years ago so I don't remember where I got it, but I was led to believe this was on the order of corporate policy. Up to the individual franchises, you suppose?
Happened to do some work on my sister's Windstar last weekend that ended up being the egr position sensor and the vacuum lines going to it. The shop owner who gave me a hand (and use of his scanner) told me the vacuum lines were something on the order of $20 each (they're like 6" long or so) from a dealer. He gave me some generic high temp tubing to use for pennies. Gotta figure if she had taken it to her local Ford dealer they would have happily put the $40 worth of oem tubing on.

Just curious, too; how do the dealership labor rates compare to the average independent shop up there? [Happened to drop a Beemer off at a dealership up the road a ways the other day where the service area was totally enclosed and air conditioned; looked like some serious overhead that would need to be recouped. But I guess if you buy a BMW you expect to pay $100/hr labor.]

One problem in our area is that if you need a dealership for GM, Chrysler, Mazda, or Toyota you're dealing with the same automotive group. Ford and L-M are each independent and there is a Pontiac/Buick dealer, other than that you have to deal with one outfit.

Dealerships are my least favorite places to drop off cars, but that's mostly for administrative reasons. At the dealerships around here, you had BETTER know, by name, the service writer/rep that the customer talked to and even then it's usually a 50-50 proposition whether they will be on the premises and not off to lunch, getting a haircut, etc. If the guy you are told to drop the car off with is not around you get the deer-in-the-headlights reaction from the other service rep's. At the independent shops we know the owner by name and that's who is there to take delivery 99 times out of 100.

My $.06 worth, LOL.
 
  #13  
Old 07-21-02, 04:28 PM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: MD
Posts: 2,079
dealerships

i was glad to listen to the bright letter that "tow" wrote. i am in my seventh decade and i find dealerships in the same company as banks , ins. co's, and corporations:: profit by all means possible doesn't bode well for the consumer.
 
  #14  
Old 07-21-02, 08:54 PM
otter_
Visiting Guest
Posts: n/a
tow_guy, where do I start?

Labour rates for domestic are creeping up, our door rate is just under $100/hr (don't forget thats 100 bucks at .65 per US dollar).

There are still a lot of independents up here that are "family run" and you don't see multi manufacturer sales and repair facilities in one spot. eg. can't sell Toyotas and GMs at the same location. In addition, it is still uncommon for a commercial outfit to have ownership/interest in a large group of dealers.

Pontiac/Buick/GMC, Chev/Olds/Cadillac/Chevy Trucks is how GM groups its franchises up here. Mercury no longer exists and Ford/Lincoln are grouped together.

On the subject of parts, I'll clarify:

Parts counter is where the parts come from 99% of the time unless the customer requests otherwise -- used or like quality jobber. We will not install Wal-Mart, Canadian Tire (similar to autozone) I supporse due to issues of who is going to warranty the part if it fails. Canadian Tire has its own installation and repair facilities, so, they can worry about installing the *unk they sell. We of course are "encouraged" by the mfg to keep OE parts on our shelves.

Common sense comes into play as well. Your vacuum line example is a good one. Mfg parts pricing on this stuff is obscene. Therefore we keep many rolls of the bulk stuff around. Pick your dia. and away you go.

I'll agree that there are honest and reputable dealerships/service departments out there and then there are the clowns that survive in spite of themselves, and, these guys give the rest of the industry a bad wrap.

Our market up here is incredibly competative due to the # of dealerships versus the # of consumers. That being said, we still tend to be about 20-30 bucks higher on our door rate than the independants.

In a nutshell, there are good ones and there are not so good ones, and I'm probably preaching to the choir

To Peterr:

Hopefully your seven decades on this planet haven't jaded you as much as you sound. We after all do live in a capitalist society and profit is not a dirty word.

My place of work puts food on the table for 160 families to begin with, nonwithstanding the generous contributions to local charity. Our operation is well respected within the local business community and nationally with GM. Careful who you tar with the same brush.

We'll I've managed to get yet another post off topic, tee hee. I sense a padlock with this thread's name on it. LOL
 
  #15  
Old 07-22-02, 04:37 AM
the_tow_guy's Avatar
Group Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: SW Fla USA
Posts: 11,477
I surely never meant to suggest that dealerships are as bad as insurance companies [my least favorite legal establishments], LOL. I suppose the catch on expensive oem stuff is that the average car owner is pretty clueless on auto repair matters, so when he goes into a dealership he doesn't KNOW that that $50 oem widget could be had for $5 around the corner at the local parts store so doesn't know to ask and is charged accordingly. I feel the key going into the lock here. Good thread.
 
  #16  
Old 07-22-02, 05:50 AM
Joe_F
Visiting Guest
Posts: n/a
Lol. You guys all make good points.

Otter hit it on the head, and so did Tow Guy:

Good and bad in everything. And that's with life too.

There are good parts people, bad ones. Good dealers, bad dealers. Good mechanics, bad ones.

To tar them all is not appropriate, however, extensive experience is a good dictator. If 50 people file a complaint with the BBB on a dealership, all 50 people can't be wrong .

In any event, my suggestion to Peter:

1) Try another dealer and ask them for clarification.

2) Ask that SAME dealer for clarification. In my belief, you're not asking them for anything of value. Ask them to explain what they are charging you. Remember, the guy you speak to at the dealership is likely a service writer, getting the information second hand from the technician. Maybe he got it wrong, or they confused two vehicles.

3) Try an independent garage, perhaps one that services exclusively foreign cars. They can get the needed OEM parts if that's what it takes.

You have a few options before plunking down 500 bucks . Go for it!
 
  #17  
Old 07-22-02, 11:51 AM
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: MD
Posts: 2,079
this forum

during dialogue, there has always been an interesting yet dynamic difference between listening and discerning.
for the information that was relevant and helpful, thank you.
peterr
 
Reply


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Display Modes
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:38 PM.