Long haul with a 302 or 351

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  #1  
Old 03-27-13, 10:00 AM
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Long haul with a 302 or 351

Within the next two months, I am moving from Maryland to Louisiana. I will be driving an F-250 which currently has a 302 which I believe is running on borrowed time.
I am going to be towing a 34 foot RV which I have stripped of all the cabinets, furniture, bathroom and kitchen fixtures. It is just an empty shell. I took it to the scales and weighed it and I have a maximum payload of 2000 pounds without exceeding the limitations of the two 3500 pound axles under it.
Anything over that will go on my truck.
So, figure I am pulling 7000 pounds and I have another 1800 or so on my truck.
The 302, even in perfect condition isn't going to be able to handle the trip, I don't think. A 351 Windsor would go into the truck without too much trouble.
I am looking for words of wisdom here. Are there better options?
Renting a U-Haul truck for the trip is very expensive and then I would have to buy a vehicle once I got there.
Any advice, anyone?
 
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  #2  
Old 03-27-13, 10:14 AM
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For what Uhaul charges I've known people to buy a trailer, use it for the move and then sell it on the other end.
 
  #3  
Old 03-27-13, 10:29 AM
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Do you have a place ready to move in to down there? Why not daily local rental on a u-haul (not a one way) and just return it after 3-4 days. 1 to load, <1 to drive down, <1 to unload, <1 to drive back? You wouldn't even have to unload the trailer til you get back down there. Or have they changed the local rentals and charge for mileage now?

As to the engine swap....well...if you have a 351 in good shape and can get it done with plenty of time left to work out any bugs... might work....but thats still a pretty big load.
 
  #4  
Old 03-27-13, 11:48 AM
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A 14' truck is $1400 one way. Then there is insurance (a must have) and about $450 for gas, close to $2000. Doing a local rental is too expensive. Looking at 2400 miles at .79 a mile plus $900 in gas.
I do have a place to go to. Hauling that thing all those miles is going to take a while, I know. And it is a lot of weight. I have to be out of my place by April 1 but I have a place I can stay and work on my truck until I am ready. I figure a couple of months to get totally ready so I have some leeway here. Wonder what it would cost to put the whole shebang on a flat bed and have it shipped down there?
Might be cheaper than the cost of an engine and assorted parts to get it all working, gas, unexpected break downs on the way, nervous breakdowns. I'll look into that. In the meantime, I'll be looking for a 351.
More input needed, please.
 
  #5  
Old 03-27-13, 11:56 AM
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My thought was to have someone ship this for you. Been a while but I know a guy who had a 40 or so foot boat shipped from somewhere out east back to the midwest for $900. I'm sure it would be more now but don't know how much more....
 
  #6  
Old 03-27-13, 12:02 PM
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Ok...so they have changed since the last time I got a local rental. Used to be able to get a 22" or so for around $45-50 a day. No mileage. Of course they were the older trucks, didn't even have A/C as I remember.

When I moved from VA to CA it was about $2400 for the truck and a car carrier. Ford E350 chassis with a V-10. Lord that thing sucked fuel...but never had an issue in the mountains. Can't imagine what the fuel cost would be now....in 2006 or so a fill up was about $75 for the tank. Of course that was only about 300 miles.
 
  #7  
Old 03-27-13, 12:22 PM
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What about the 302 concerns you? I'm curious if a bit of maintenance will extend the life enough for the drive, even if it's the last hurrah...

I ask in part because I drove around in a '78 Cordoba with a wiped cam lobe and a bad oil leak for almost 70,000 miles. I added oil frequently, but it did run.
 
  #8  
Old 03-27-13, 12:54 PM
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A while back it blew a head gasket. I pulled it all apart and replaced head gaskets on both sides. I didn't have a machinists straight edge so I didn't check the surface of the block or the head. I didn't check for cracks but I saw no evidence of cracks. I cleaned real well around the exhaust ports, or so I thought, and torqued everything together per the manual. Now, in number one cylinder, there is a loud ticking that sounds like a sticking valve or lifter, but isn't. I took the exhaust manifold off again, looked for defects, didn't find any and put a new gasket on and installed the manifold again. It was better for a while but came back. I am thinking I missed something on the head, the manifold or the exhaust manifold is cracked.
Then there is the oil leaks around the pan. Then there is the low compression in the cylinder where the head gasket is blown.
Maybe I should address those issues and see where I am but I just don't think the 302 is going to be able to haul this thing all that way.
 
  #9  
Old 03-28-13, 01:23 AM
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A while back it blew a head gasket. I pulled it all apart and replaced head gaskets on both sides. I didn't have a machinists straight edge so I didn't check the surface of the block or the head. I didn't check for cracks but I saw no evidence of cracks. I cleaned real well around the exhaust ports, or so I thought, and torqued everything together per the manual. Now, in number one cylinder, there is a loud ticking that sounds like a sticking valve or lifter, but isn't. I took the exhaust manifold off again, looked for defects, didn't find any and put a new gasket on and installed the manifold again. It was better for a while but came back. I am thinking I missed something on the head, the manifold or the exhaust manifold is cracked.
Then there is the oil leaks around the pan. Then there is the low compression in the cylinder where the head gasket is blown.

Maybe I should address those issues and see where I am but I just don't think the 302 is going to be able to haul this thing all that way.
Depending on the mileage you have on the engine the ticking sound could come from a weak lifter, even though the lifter is not a collapsed lifter. The lifter sound could be caused by weak oil pressure as well. When parts wear, the tolerances become larger and tend to make more noise.

Even if you had a warped head, it's unlikely that is causing the sound. Additionally, a ticking sound does not mean your engine is going to fail. I have a '65 Ford Ranchero with a 289 engine. Every time I start the car the lifters rattle for a while and even with the engine warm one or two lifters make a ticking sound. If you have been driving that engine for a few thousand miles or more, with the ticking sound and it hasn't change then I wouldn't worry about it.

An exhaust leak will make a "tic" sound depending where you're standing when you hear it. A lose or cracked manifold, or a blown exhaust manifold gasket could be the cause of your tic. As a suggestion you might drive one side of the car up a ramp and crawl under the car with the engine is running and listen for the tick, making sure the car will not roll while you're under there. If it's a exhaust leak, it will be much louder under the car.

You could also check for a lose spark plug. I've seen lose plugs that were held in place only by the spark plug wire.

However, with all the problems you mention about your 302, if you can afford it find a good used 351 and drop in your engine bay. As far as your choice of engines to make the long haul, the 351 Windsor is a better choice than the 302. The 302 is a great engine, but it doesn't have much torque. The 351 does a better job pulling up hills under load, not to mention better daily drivability.
 

Last edited by teagueAMX; 03-28-13 at 01:42 AM.
  #10  
Old 03-28-13, 08:41 AM
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I don't know if this engine uses rocker studs or rocker shafts. A friend of mine had a rocker shaft retaining bolt loosen up and we thought that his engine was toast. On a whim we pulled the valvecovers and found the bolt sitting on the top of the head.
 
  #11  
Old 03-28-13, 12:42 PM
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I don't know if this engine uses rocker studs or rocker shafts. A friend of mine had a rocker shaft retaining bolt loosen up and we thought that his engine was toast. On a whim we pulled the valvecovers and found the bolt sitting on the top of the head.


Good point. I thnk Ford used rocker shafts on the 302, but I could be wrong.
 
  #12  
Old 03-29-13, 08:43 PM
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OEM Ford didn't use gaskets between the head & exhaust manifold.. If the manifold is warped (not unusual) & you used a gasket, it's leaking & possibly causing your ticking sound.. Check for leaks & after you check the manifold for straightness, replace the manifold if leaking, don't install a gasket.. Roger
 
  #13  
Old 03-30-13, 04:38 PM
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You are joking me! Well, learn something new every day. I have never heard of that. Well, I guess it is time to take it back off and find a straight edge somewhere. I just knew when I was putting it on the last time I should check it but I didn't have anything to check it with so I took a chance.
Serious though, OEM Ford did not use a gasket there?
 
  #14  
Old 03-30-13, 08:05 PM
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Chrysler also didn't use gaskets between the head and the exhaust manifold on the LA and Magnum V8s from the factory, though once one pulls an exhaust manifold one basically has to now use one as the two will not perfectly mate anymore.

I drove a van at work that had a mild tick because of an imperfect exhaust seal.
 
  #15  
Old 04-01-13, 08:18 PM
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Really,, I have been a Ford Tech @ a Dealer for 25 years & if you need a gasket, the manifold is warped.. I know the gaskets are available in the aftermarket, but sometimes the aftermarket doesen't really fix the root cause of the problem (ie,, warped /cracked exhaust manifold,,)) ...Roger
 
  #16  
Old 04-13-13, 06:30 PM
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I got bigger problems than the noisy exhaust header right now. I suppose I should start another thread on it. I'm so confused about it I can't even describe the problem right now other than it won't start. I thought it was a fuel pump but now I'm not sure I ever had a fuel pump problem. Let me just ask one question. On the driver's side, just behind the air cleaner, there are two relays. One is the fuel pump relay (I hope anyway). Is the other one the ECM relay? I replaced the intank fuel pump because it wasn't pumping. After replacing it and still it didn't pump, I replaced the relay. I get power to the relay but then I would check the inertia switch and no power.
Tomorrow is another day. I'll tackle it again tomorrow.
 
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