Water Piping Choices


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Old 06-19-06, 11:48 PM
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Water Piping Choices

My 1918 bungalow has mostly galvanized piping, with some cpvc. I am getting ready to re-do it. I guess it would have been cheaper last year. With copper so expensive , should I think about pex or some other alternative? I want to do it right, and do it for the long haul...but I don't want to spend more if I don't need to.
 
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Old 06-20-06, 04:16 AM
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Since you already have some cpvc, is there an objection to running it to replace the galvanized? It is easy to work with, and is ALOT cheaper than copper. Just a suggestion, since your house was built a long time ago, make home runs of 3/4" and only use 1/2" where you turn up for a sink, toilet, washer, etc. This gives you good volume and less pressure drop if someone flushes while you are in the shower.
 
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Old 06-20-06, 05:46 AM
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cpvc

I have been under the impression (from a local plumber)that I should not use cpvc any more. Was he just trying to get me to have HIM install copper?
 
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Old 06-20-06, 07:36 AM
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I always tell my customers that when choosing materials in the mechanicals of your home that you should never dictate what should go in the walls by how much it costs.

It should always go by what has the best track record, period.

So it could be the mix of numerous different piping systems. If price is dictating the install, I can produce 1000's of customers that have regrets of using products that were "fast and cheap".

The others that spent the money don't even think of their plumbing. They use it without interruption, so it's not an issue.
 
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Old 06-20-06, 08:00 AM
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reading between the lines in your response, should I assume that copper should be the way to go? I'm willing to spend whatever.....I was just wondering if pex would be good alternative?
Thanks!
 
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Old 06-20-06, 08:50 AM
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As a moderator I'm supposed to be "unbiased" in my opinions but I live in an area where copper is installed in 95% of the homes with no known reliability issues. So of course I follow the reliability of what works best in my 3 state area.

I've been in many discussions of plastic piping over copper but in the end I forsee the same issues that has plagued plastic piping all along, durability. Not only can it not be put in sunlight, chemicals/petroleum base products can leach right through it affecting water quality.

Ask someone who has rented a crimper from a rental yard that lost its calibration months earlier before they didn't want to spend $100 plus dollars on a tool they'll never use again. And if your home has a history of mice infestations, your piping is susceptible to them gnawing on the soft matter to keep their teeth from overgrowing.

Comments like above usually sparks a debate with others following all bad things about copper. If copper is such a bad thing, wouldn't we be ripping it all out with class action lawsuits like the last 3 products plastic produced???????????????????????

Remember, copper pipe failures always lead to a source problem, meaning geographical and water treatment plants sending out water with too high of a ph level which in turn creates acidic water. That's why they make acid neutralizer systems to deal with such problems. Replacing piping to "cover up" a bigger problem falls back to the credibility of the installer.

There are 60 plus year copper water services in my area with no failures. I learned years ago when I entered the www that what works in my back yard doesn't always work in yours.

I feel sorry for people that have terrible water quality issues with either lack of funds to fix them or the inability to comprehend what is the cause and effect issue it generates. I believe Pex piping is wonderful in the beginning and must be a breeze to install, I look at the down the road service issues that it can create. That piping gets harder as time moves on and getting a crimp to clamp a hardened plastic pipe over a barb fitting is going to be undependable......and compression connections are normally not allowed in concealed locations.

Oh well, there's my tuesday lunchtime rant!
 
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Old 06-20-06, 12:08 PM
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Thanks for the candor! I think I will use copper!
 
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Old 06-20-06, 03:05 PM
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Unless you have really bad water, install the copper, sit back and relax and enjoy it. Everytime I see the "pros" ranting about the advantages of ANY plastic piping, I think back to the "POLY-FOLLY" of a few years back. Good luck.
 
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Old 06-20-06, 05:06 PM
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We have only had one significant problem with hard copper here in the south. Sand. Unless well water is filtered properly, sand can eat a hole in copper and it isn't a repair, it is a complete replace, as it seems to move down line within a very short period of time. The walls get so thin, you can crush them with your hand.
Likewise the flexible "pex" type tubing has its problems, and it is mostly from improper installation, or tools out of calibration.
We do use alot of cpvc here, so how 'bout some insight on its detriments. I know copper is good, and it lasts a long time, but is the current economic situation with copper worth the offset of using cpvc. Just a curiosity question. I am in the wrong business, of installing electrical wire.....I should be selling it.
 
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Old 06-20-06, 07:46 PM
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Here ya go:


http://www.builderswebsource.com/tec...cpvccopper.htm

Shows both sides of the gammut.

I just worked on a high end home today replacing the rear hose bibb that had CPVC throughout the home. The piping was sagging between supports from age and "ticking" every time the hot was used.

I ended up using copper out of the hose bibb and then sweating one side of the compression union to the copper, the other side I used to reconnect to CPVC.

Two things: I did not want to use any glue on any connection because I don't trust homeowners to NOT turn their water back on within the allocated dry time. (12-24 hours) Those are my requirements, not the mfg. as I do not want any connection I put together to come back apart. If you look on the glue cans, it will say you can test with air within 2 hours.......water is substantially longer.

That hose bibb was leaking at a glue joint and when I reached to pull the hose bibb out the pipe instantly snapped at the threaded connection. Not surprised as the product hardens and gets very brittle as it ages.

But, I just removed a faulty copper hose bibb friday due to freezing and blowing out a hole in the side of the pipe.

One was due to its physical properties and the other due to customer error.
 
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Old 06-21-06, 04:05 AM
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Great site, thanks for the info.
 
 

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