Washer/utility tub drain and vent help needed..

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Old 07-11-13, 10:01 PM
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Washer/utility tub drain and vent help needed..

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I need some washer drain advice. After reading this forum, I realized that I messed up the plumbing in my new laundry room. I didn't put vents in the design. Now, I have to try to fix the problem without messing up my newly plastered walls and new ceramic floor. Anyway, I have attached a scetch of what I am planning on doing. I hope someone out there can tell me if it OK and if it will work.

I am new to this site so I am not sure if the photo will show up correctly. So I will try to describe my plan. On the left is a utility tub with 1.5" tailpipe 4" long That goes into a 1.5" P trap. The exit side of the P trap has an arm about 6" long. That arm goes into a 2" sanitary T/Y via a 1.5 to 2" bushing. From this point on all pipe is 2" dia. The top of the T/Y goes to an AAV in the attic. The bottom of this T/Y goes into the top of a second sanitary T/Y which drains through 2- 90* elbows and into a floor drain. The second (bottom) T/Y has a 15" horizontal pipe that connects on the right side. The horizontal pipe is connected to a P trap. The P trap goes directly into a 30" stand pipe.

Things to consider: I am working with very limited access to the wall from the back. Also, the drain in the floor is several inches from the wall. That is why I go through 2-90* elbows to get to it. This doesn't cause me too much grief since it will be hidden under the utility tub cabinet. The Utility tub pipe goes straight into the wall, so the top T/Y doesn't really go to the left like I show in my picture. I just didn't know how to draw a pipe that come straight out at you from the page, so I drew it turned 90* to the left. Since the tub drain goes straight into the wall and the washer drain is a 90* turn to the right, I can not use a double san tee, unless they make ones with that configuration ( like one that you would use in a corner of two walls). If they do make one, they don't have them in the places I shop for plumbing stuff (Lowes and Ace).

Any comments or suggestions would be much appreciated. I am still trying to understand this venting thing. Water pipes seem easier to me...

DIY-Sally
 
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Old 07-12-13, 06:04 AM
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Hi... Welcome...

That whole set up connects to the floor drain how??? Is it just kind of stuck down there with no direct connection?
 
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Old 07-12-13, 07:34 AM
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The drain in the floor is a 2" pipe that runs into the basement and connects to a 4" Y with a cleanout top. I was just going to glue a 90* street elbow into it. Is that OK?
 
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Old 07-12-13, 09:03 AM
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Take a pic of it please....
 
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Old 07-12-13, 09:38 AM
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I think you're on the right track. You're in good hands with Mike(Lawrosa) looking at it.

Why the AAV in the attic as opposed to going up through the roof to a proper vent? If you got it up that far, it is probably worth going out through the roof too.
 
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Old 07-12-13, 10:17 AM
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Pictures...

Ok. I'm not sure what you wanted pics of, so I took a few. The first is the dry fit that is going to be moved back into the wall behind it. The vent stack will be 9.5' and go to an AAV. The 1.5" p trap on the left will connect to the tail pipe of the utility tub. There is an elbow resting on the floor that will be glued into the pipe that is currently in the floor. There is a closer picture of this in the second pic.

The 2" pipe in the floor goes through more pipe and a few elbows and eventually connects to a 4" pipe with a clean out at the top before going into the basement floor and off to the wild blue yonder (meaning I don't know where it goes after the basement floor). I do know that the waste water from my bathroom connects under the cement to this pipe. I can look down the clean out with a flash light and see the water from the bathroom running through it. The third pic is where it connects to the 4" pipe and goes into the basement floor. Sorry it's not a real good pic, it's in a hard spot to get to.

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Thanks for the help!
 
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Old 07-12-13, 10:20 AM
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Well, my roof is old and I am afraid I will do damage if I try to go through it and cause a leak. I plan to have the roof replaced with in the next 2 years and I was planning on taking the vent through the roof then. The AAV is just temporary.
 
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Old 07-12-13, 10:47 AM
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Oh my....That hole in the floor is a cleanout???? Its not a floor drain is it... Take a pic down the hole...

What type of ceiling do you have... Why dont you build a mini wall over that...

You can run 1 1/2 to the roof...

Thats a wet vent and you cant put thos two tees on top of each other.... Why not just drain the washer in the laundry tub... Much easier...
 
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Old 07-12-13, 11:35 AM
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Maybe I need more help than I thought... What's the difference between a cleanout and a drain? I'm pretty sure it's a clean out. The guy at the "box store" told me I could connect the washer drain to this cleanout rather than running drain lines all the way to the other side of the house. Then he sold me the adapter to do it. You know, I know better than to listen to a sales associate, it always seems to get me in trouble. How do I fix this? I was planning on running both the washer and the utility tub to this "hole" in the basement floor. So even if I do drain the washer into the utility tub, it's still going to the same hole in the basement floor.
 
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Old 07-12-13, 12:06 PM
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What's the difference between a cleanout and a drain?
If that was a floor drain then there would be a trap in the floor... ( Was anything ever glued in there?)

You can do away with the washer drain and just plumb for the laundry sink... Technically you could stick a bushing in there and do all 1 1/2...

I would like to see a half wall at least built over that . Possibly a little bigger like a table with access. Table can be laundry folding area....


But I am curious about this... It looks new and with water pipes.... Casn you tell me the story???

Not that its important but seeing how nothing was glued in that clean out makes me wonder...

Why did they not extend that through the floor and in the wall? Especially a hub in the floor... Yikes...

Or put it in a place where the wall was being built?? Seems like they got the water right...
 
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Old 07-12-13, 04:42 PM
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Long story...

I will do my best to shed some light on the situation. The “they” you are asking question about would be me. The pipe is new, I put it in.

I decided to make a laundry room out of one of my spare bedrooms. When I went down stairs to figure out how to run the plumbing I found the clean out in the floor under the basement stairs. The waste stack for the bathroom is on the other side of the house and runs through the pipe where the clean out is as does the kitchen drain and the basement laundry room drain. Since all the drain water in the house seems to come into this pipe, it seemed reasonable that I could tap the drain for the new laundry room in here. I went to the “box store” and ask the plumbing associate if I could do this. He said yes and gave me a fitting that screwed down into the cleanout on one end and had a 4” pipe connection on the other. I didn’t want to lose the clean out so I added the Y for the new laundry room drain and put the clean out above it. This stack isn’t glued into the floor clean out, it is screwed in with some Teflon tape.

The original plan for the laundry room was to drain the washer into a utility tub and just leave the plumbing exposed under the tub. This tub drain would go through a P trap and down into the basement stack that I connected to the clean out. As I stated in my first post, I didn’t plan for a vent.

Directly behind the wall where the new appliances are going is a stairway to the basement and one above that goes to the attic. Apparently a previous owner put these stairs in. When they put these stairs in they took out a support beam and did not double up the surrounding support to take up the extra load. As a result, the beam under the wall was terribly warped, cracked and caused a crack in my foundation. To fix that I jacked up the corner of the house, fixed the foundation and added two more support beams directly against the old warped one. Having a triple beam directly under the wall made it impossible to get plumbing into the wall. So I took the plumbing up through the floor. I didn’t care anyway; I was leaving the plumbing under the tub exposed anyway.

Then my plans changes and I ended up re-plastering the walls and adding a new floor. After all of that was done and looked so nice, I decided I didn’t want exposed plumbing and I had to figure out a way to put in the vent that I neglected in the original design. I started to research online how to install the vent and saw lay outs for the stack pipe. I like how clean and neat it looks, so I decided to figure out a way to drain my washer that way.

I am not sure I understand what you are saying about building a table above the plumbing. The photo I posted is just the dry fit of the pipes, its not going to be in front of the wall. I am going to figure out a way to put it inside the wall. Once I push that set up back into the wall, the only thing that will show is a pipe coming out of the bottom of the wall and going through a 90* elbow into the floor. This will be hidden by the utility tub cabinet. I also plan to move the water lines into the wall as close to the floor as possible. They too will be hidden by the cabinet.

So, here I am. I apparently can’t connect to a waste line via a cleanout. I don’t really understand why this is a problem since all the water in the house ends up in this pipe anyway. But none the less, How do I fix this???

Also, I now plan on killing the AAV Vent idea and going through the roof to vent the system. It seems that people in this forum aren’t fans of the AAV.

Would it be an acceptable design if I added another T to the 15" horizontal run after the 2” P trap just before it goes into the San T then put a second vent going up and connecting to the first vent a foot or so above the washer????

I know this is a very long post, and I really do appreciate all of the help. I am learning a lot and knowledge is a powerful thing. Thank you.
 
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Old 07-12-13, 06:52 PM
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Ok I thought this was the basement..

Can you show me where you connected and where it comes up though the floor.... ( Pics from basement)

I did not say you could not do it... It does look hokey and I would just move it in the wall... Do it once, do it right..

The problem is you cant have two Y's like that for the sink and laundry box... Double fixture fitting if anything....

Why didnt you put the water lines in the wall?

Why dont you move the drain in the wall?

I guess you could leave it like that if the sink will cover it....



Ok just use the sink only or get a double fixture fitting.... Not a double sanitary tee....
 
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Old 07-13-13, 05:52 AM
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If at first you don't succeed....

Here are pictures of the connection into the basement floor. I mistakenly stated that it was a 4” pipe. As you can see in the picture, I reduced it down to a 3” pipe. It is just screwed into the cleanout, so I can move it if necessary.

As for doing it right the first time… well that ship has sailed. My hope now is to get it right the second time and learn from my mistakes. Hopefully I have learned enough to get it right the first time on the next project (which will be a bathroom in the basement this coming winter).

The second picture shows why I can’t bring the plumbing up through the wall. It shows the beam I installed to fix the damaged support beam resulting from the installation of the stairs. The beams are touching together at the top. The beam on the left, the painted one, is the original damaged beam. These beams are directly under the wall I need to work in. My thought here was to take both water and drain lines through the floor then into the wall under the utility sink cabinet. I plan on turning them 90* just above floor level to get into the wall, then 90* to get them going up the inside of the wall. I will have to cut a few holes in the cabinet bottom, but that will only be seen when the doors to the cabinet are open.

The third picture is the latest drain design. I got rid of the stacked Y’s and added a double San T. The top of this double T will go through the roof for a vent. Does this latest design do the trick????
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Old 07-13-13, 06:12 AM
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You said....

I got rid of the stacked Y’s and added a double San T.
I said.....

Ok just use the sink only or get a double fixture fitting.... Not a double sanitary tee....

You need a double fixture fitting... This is code... The bends are different... It has to do with the trap weir if your wondering...

A double san tee is more flat....

This is a double fixture fitting..




Double san tee




Lastly when you screwed that adapter in the floor did you use teflon tape or paste on the threads??? It hardly looks in there enought and you will probably have a leak...

Whats this sink cabinet look like?

How will you put it to the wall with the vent in the way???

Just wondering....( The ships are still sailing......)
 
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Old 07-13-13, 07:27 AM
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Stopping ships....

I see… the double fixture fitting look more like long 90* than the San T.

Here is a picture of a partially built sink cabinet sitting in front of the proposed plumbing.

The vent hole is just a hole that goes back into the basement stairway. It was going to be a small fan vent that draws air from the stairway which gets very warm when I fire up my downstairs wood burner. Since I decided to put a cabinet here, I have eliminated this fan vent. So now it is just a hole.

I used teflon tape on the adapter in the floor, but apparently not enough. I will thoroughly test it for leaks. If it leaks, I can cut the 3” pipe and removed the adapter. Then add more teflon tape or paste (which to you suggest??). Then put it back together by coupling the 3” pipe where I cut it.

If I change the double San T to a double fixture fitting and fix any leaks I may have with the connection in the basement floor, will I be OK then??????

Beleive me, I am trying hard to stop these ships from sailing...

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Old 07-13-13, 08:12 AM
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Then add more teflon tape or paste (which to you suggest??).
Paste..

So is that 3" all the way from basement to floor??? Or did you switch to 2" somewhere????

If I change the double San T to a double fixture fitting and fix any leaks I may have with the connection in the basement floor, will I be OK then??????

Yes....


Oh here is your ship...LOL


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txdurr1llM4
 
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Old 07-13-13, 09:04 AM
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Almost there....

LOL... Im going to look like that lady on the front of that ship before this is all over...weathered and shirt hanging half off... LOL

Here is a picture of the stack in the basement where the 2" pipe that I ran from the new laundry room connects into the 3" pipe. So to answer your question, I did switch to 2" between the floor of the laundry room and the floor of the basement.

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Old 07-13-13, 09:45 AM
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Ohh... Cool...

FYI... In plumbing when you go from vertical to horizontal you need a sweep... That ell on left should be long sweep...

When you go horizontal to vert you could just use an ell...

So that 3 x 2 with the sweep really was not needed there. That fitting is normally used on the horizontal if you know what I mean.....

Should you change the ell on left to sweep????? Code would say yes ASAIK... Will it make a difference in laundry app????

Your call... Im just bringing it to your attention...

That male adapter in the floor does not look like its turned in too much..... 2 or 3 threads???


Ill make you a plumber yet....
 
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Old 07-13-13, 10:11 AM
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You have no idea how much I appreciate all of the help. I will change the ell on the left when I re-do the connection into the floor.

I have just one last question (hopefully the last question)... You said to put paste on the connection in the floor. Can you be more spacific? I can not buy the double fixture fitting anywhere near me, so I am going to order it online. I thought I would order the paste also. I found Bramec Slic-Tite Paste on the web site where I plan to get the fitting

16144 - Carrier 16144 - 1/2 Pint Bramec Slic-Tite Paste

Is this the correct stuff???
 
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Old 07-13-13, 10:41 AM
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Go to plumbing supply here... they sell to the public.... You can get the fitting and paste...

Call.. Make sure a plumbing location..

Locations Finder


Hercules real tuff teflon paste is all I use... Past 30 years...


 
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Old 07-13-13, 11:16 AM
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Will do.

Thanks again for all the help. I am sure you saved me much heartache.

DIY Sally
 
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