Just another ancient pool

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  #1  
Old 07-11-07, 02:31 PM
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Just another ancient pool

We bought an abandoned house five years ago. It has an inground (outdoor) pool, 20 x 40 kidney shaped, deep for diving. It is fiberglass with concrete behind that. Among the many problems getting it up and running, there was a huge rip in the side wall when we bought it. I repaired that with resin and fiberglass cloth. The top of the wall now fits just below the coping so unless the it is full of water, the wall tends to lean into the pool showing the concrete behind it. Looking behind the wall I can see metal strips running vertically every so many feet. I also see what looks like the rusted remains of screws or nails that ran from the pool wall into the concrete. I suppose that this is normal for water to get between the fiberglass and concrete. On a few of these, the rust shows through to the wall facing the inside of the pool.

This year I have small cracks all over the bottom of the pool. I've drained it. When I walk over them water seeps through so I know they are not just in the paint. I also have two more rips in the side wall on the opposite side of the pool. I'd post pictures but I'm not allowed to post attachments.

1. What do I use to fasten the pool wall back to the concrete? I don't want to use standard "Ramset" low velocity powder fasteners because they are not stainless steel and I'm convinced they will rust away again even after I coat them over with fiberglass resin and cloth. I don't feel comfortable using screws. I don't want to just fiberglass over the new rip without attaching the wall back to the concrete.

2. What is the most economical way to take care of all the small cracks? Do I just dribble the resin over them or do I have to use some of the fiberglass cloth too? I can't really afford some of the expensive alternatives out there. I've already spent a couple of hundred just cleaning it out and getting this far this year.

Thank you in advance for any help!
 
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  #2  
Old 07-11-07, 07:19 PM
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Please find below my comments to your questions they are started by ***

Originally Posted by almanon View Post
We bought an abandoned house five years ago. It has an inground (outdoor) pool, 20 x 40 kidney shaped, deep for diving. It is fiberglass with concrete behind that. Among the many problems getting it up and running, there was a huge rip in the side wall when we bought it. I repaired that with resin and fiberglass cloth. The top of the wall now fits just below the coping so unless the it is full of water, the wall tends to lean into the pool showing the concrete behind it. Looking behind the wall I can see metal strips running vertically every so many feet. I also see what looks like the rusted remains of screws or nails that ran from the pool wall into the concrete. I suppose that this is normal for water to get between the fiberglass and concrete. On a few of these, the rust shows through to the wall facing the inside of the pool.

This year I have small cracks all over the bottom of the pool. I've drained it. When I walk over them water seeps through so I know they are not just in the paint. I also have two more rips in the side wall on the opposite side of the pool. I'd post pictures but I'm not allowed to post attachments.

***you can post pics to photobucket.com and post the link to them here.
pictures will really help.

1. What do I use to fasten the pool wall back to the concrete? I don't want to use standard "Ramset" low velocity powder fasteners because they are not stainless steel and I'm convinced they will rust away again even after I coat them over with fiberglass resin and cloth. I don't feel comfortable using screws. I don't want to just fiberglass over the new rip without attaching the wall back to the concrete.

***Without seeing pics, I would use a high strenghth adhesive between wall and concrete, then use some stainless steel screws and tap the wall then screw tightly.

2. What is the most economical way to take care of all the small cracks? Do I just dribble the resin over them or do I have to use some of the fiberglass cloth too? I can't really afford some of the expensive alternatives out there. I've already spent a couple of hundred just cleaning it out and getting this far this year.

***Again, pics would help but if the cracks are very small I would fill them with resin, cloth of course would not hurt. Make sure to scuff the surface to get a good bond.

Thank you in advance for any help!
 
  #3  
Old 07-12-07, 05:17 PM
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I'll post links to some pictures. Hopefully this will work:

The whole pool:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/pools002.jpg

You can see the entire pool here (toilet bowl view). An old repair on the right side with the wall leaning in a bit. Behind this wall you see some metal strips running vertically behind the concrete.

An old crack repaired:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/pools003.jpg

Here you see an old crack that I repaired a couple of years ago. I used fiberglass cloth and resin. It held up pretty good. I had a lot of trouble keeping the fiberglass standing up during the repair. I used several 2 x 4's and braced one wall against the opposite wall. It was painted over well, but since I'm doing so many other repairs, I went ahead and sanded this down and I'm going to put another larger layer of fiberglass over it before repainting it again. It is this section that I'd like to attach back to the concrete behind it somehow.

Behind leaning wall:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/pools008.jpg

Here you can see behind the leaning wall and the rusty screw.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/pools009.jpg

Here you can see behind the leaning wall, the concrete, and the metal strip. You can see the Liquid Nails that I attempted to use to attach the fiberglass to the concrete.

Damaged Coping:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/pools010.jpg

Here is a picture of some coping that I can't figure out how to fix.

Crack in left side of pool:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/pools004.jpg

Here is a large crack where it looks like the wall has bulged in. I'd like to push this back in and reattach it to the concrete. I shined a light in the crack and I can see concrete but not why the bulge was there in the first place.

Closer view of crack:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/pools005.jpg


Another crack close to the last one viewed from the opposite direction:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/pools006.jpg


Lots of little cracks all over the floor of the pool:
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/pools007.jpg

They range in size from 1/4 inch to several inches. The longest one I found was about 3 feet long.
 
  #4  
Old 07-12-07, 05:54 PM
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So what it looks like is you have a pool that was originally built as a concrete bottom and fibeglass walls. Somewhere down the road it looks like someone had a thin fiberglass coating put into the shell. This fiberglass liner is what is giving the trouble.
Bad news is your problems are probably only going to worsen. I would suggest looking into puting a vinyl liner in pool. If you want to continue to patch, there is a adhesive called dynamix, it is a 2 part adhesive that is applied with what looks like a caulking gun, it has a tip that actually swirls the 2 componets together so it comes out of the tip mixed. It is STRONG...
I would use this to fill in behind all cracks then seal the top with resin. I would also use this for the wall problem and screws as mentioned earlier.
 
  #5  
Old 07-14-07, 08:40 AM
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Patch, coat, or put in vinyl

So my options are:

1. to continue to patch
2. to put in a vinyl liner

I bought a hammer drill and plan on using concrete anchor screws with corrosion resistant coating and stainless steel washers to give a larger holding area. If I can find Dynamix do I shoot it behind the walls? I looks like it expands like foam. Is that OK? Should the fiberglass wall be sealed to the concrete? It won't create a dam for water will it (hydrostatic pressure area)?

Option #2: Would a vinyl liner fit inside what I have now? Or would I have to cut out all the old fiberglass and patch up the remaining concrete? From looking at info on these, there is foam padding that I could use behind the vinyl.

Option #3: What about a resurfacing option? If I have to spend the money what about a major resurfacing option like Fibre-Shelkote™ Vinyl Ester Resin II (claim 30 year life expectancy). http://www.uglassit.com/ I like what I read about this. It looks like I'd have to sand blast the pool first which is a process I've never done. But 30 years sounds pretty good to me! There may be other coating process that are better, easier, cheaper? This looks like a huge DIY project but maybe it will save me from having to constantly repair and patch every single season.

Thank you for your responses - this has been a great source of help!
 
  #6  
Old 07-14-07, 08:35 PM
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Replies are below...

Originally Posted by almanon View Post
So my options are:

1. to continue to patch
2. to put in a vinyl liner

I bought a hammer drill and plan on using concrete anchor screws with corrosion resistant coating and stainless steel washers to give a larger holding area. If I can find Dynamix do I shoot it behind the walls? I looks like it expands like foam. Is that OK? Should the fiberglass wall be sealed to the concrete? It won't create a dam for water will it (hydrostatic pressure area)?

***Yes you'll want to put it behind the wall or under the floor, where ever there is a crack. This will give it a backing so it won't bend back and forth from water weight or walking over it.

Option #2: Would a vinyl liner fit inside what I have now? Or would I have to cut out all the old fiberglass and patch up the remaining concrete? From looking at info on these, there is foam padding that I could use behind the vinyl.

*** yes, they can be made to custom fit your pool like a glove. The only thibg you might need is a liner track around the coping, not sure if you have track there now.

Option #3: What about a resurfacing option? If I have to spend the money what about a major resurfacing option like Fibre-Shelkote™ Vinyl Ester Resin II (claim 30 year life expectancy). http://www.uglassit.com/ I like what I read about this. It looks like I'd have to sand blast the pool first which is a process I've never done. But 30 years sounds pretty good to me! There may be other coating process that are better, easier, cheaper? This looks like a huge DIY project but maybe it will save me from having to constantly repair and patch every single season.

*** I can't really comment to yea or ney on this, I'm not familiar with it. But keep in mind, if you are going to remove all the fiberglass, you could have the pool replastered if you wanted to spend that kind of money. Just another option, hard to say what would be best way to go without seeing.

Thank you for your responses - this has been a great source of help!
 
  #7  
Old 07-29-07, 04:58 PM
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Unhappy Damaged concrete behind the fiberglass wall.

http://s100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/?action=view&current=DSC01696.jpg
Shows a lot of the repairs that I've made. Tons! Plus I re-repaired the crack on the right side, and fiberglassed over the light since there was water in it.

Here is a picture of the crack on the left side from a short distance for perspective. The structure that looks like a bridge is $36 in 2 x 4's for a platform. I kept sliding down to the drain when I tried to work on this area. http://s100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/?action=view&current=DSC01695.jpg

I pulled a section of fiberglass from the wall at the crack on the left side. Now I can see that what should be solid concrete looks like a mixture of dirt and concrete. Looks like there was water coming through here and deteriorated the concrete.
see: http://s100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/?action=view&current=DSC01694.jpg


So, what can be done with this? I dug out junk from about 6 inches back into the concrete. The area above the crack looks solid. Is there a way to spray something in there and seal it up, then fill it with something before I repair the wall?
 
  #8  
Old 07-29-07, 07:35 PM
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WOW have you been doing some work... The more I look at your pics, it looks like your pool might have been a vinyl liner at one time. Does the coping around the pool have a track just under it? Maybe filled in with fiberglass? It is difficult to say what to do without being able to actually see and touch. I don't know what you could spray in the hole, you might be able to use hydrolic cement.
 
  #9  
Old 07-29-07, 08:32 PM
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Wink

Any of the companys that where putting glass in the pool down in Fl . Have all gone by by and dont do it anymore. Thats on a good gunnite pool.It dont work. I had look into it before redoing the marcite on two pools I had. What is the water table there??? Do you have a pump out for under the pool when its empty are need one??? Then what resin is the pool made of???? If epoxy then you cant use a poyester resin on it. But if it is polyester then you can use epoxy to patch it.
From the picture I cant make out what is behind the glass. Dont look like much. I think I saw a dive board frame there. Check with your home owners insurance Ill bet its not covered. Thats why you dont see a dive board at any motels anymore.

My .02 cents
 
  #10  
Old 07-30-07, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by todrut View Post
WOW have you been doing some work... The more I look at your pics, it looks like your pool might have been a vinyl liner at one time. Does the coping around the pool have a track just under it? Maybe filled in with fiberglass? It is difficult to say what to do without being able to actually see and touch. I don't know what you could spray in the hole, you might be able to use hydrolic cement.
No, there is no track.
 
  #11  
Old 07-30-07, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Ed Imeduc View Post
Any of the companys that where putting glass in the pool down in Fl . Have all gone by by and dont do it anymore. Thats on a good gunnite pool.It dont work. I had look into it before redoing the marcite on two pools I had. What is the water table there??? Do you have a pump out for under the pool when its empty are need one??? Then what resin is the pool made of???? If epoxy then you cant use a poyester resin on it. But if it is polyester then you can use epoxy to patch it.
From the picture I cant make out what is behind the glass. Dont look like much. I think I saw a dive board frame there. Check with your home owners insurance Ill bet its not covered. Thats why you dont see a dive board at any motels anymore.

My .02 cents
There is a releif valve at the bottom drain that lets water in to the pool if the pressure under the pool is greater than the pressure in the pool.

I've been using the resin and fiberglass frrom the local hardware stores. It seems to be working. The oldest repair that I've made is 3 years old, and it looks just as good as when I put it in.

I took off the diving board first thing because there was some rot on the underside.

There is concrete behind the fiberglass. It is very very hard where it is solid, but in this one spot it is like dirt. Should I pressure spray all of the debris out of there and try to fill in the vacancy with something? I've had to learn all sorts of new skills working on this pool - now concrete...
 
  #12  
Old 07-30-07, 03:30 PM
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Wink

I think Id try and clean out that hole and fill it in with blocks bricks and cement. them glass over. When you dont know what you have in glass go with the Epoxy.
 
  #13  
Old 08-02-07, 08:21 AM
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Smile Wow

I must give you some serious credit for all the time and hard work you have put into this massive project. I have read your story and looked at all your pictures and am truely astonished that you even have the courage to continue to work on your unique pool. I hope that you are able to figure something out and post the pictures of the finished pool. Good Luck and you are truely an inspiration to those of us who are really scared to try DIY projects!!
 
  #14  
Old 09-01-07, 10:40 AM
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update

I cleaned out the hole with a pressure washer. Let it dry, then painted on concrete adhesion promoter, then filled in the hole with concrete. It took numerous little applications using a thin cut sheet of wood to hold the concrete in the hole. After I filled in the hole, I ground it down to be flush with the rest of the concrete surface. Then I replaced the fiberglass pieces, fastened them to the concrete with anchors, and glued them together with resin and fiberglass mat. This took a lot of time in the evenings and on weekends. These pictures show what it now looks like.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/DSC01697.jpg
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/DSC01698.jpg
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/DSC01699.jpg
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m13/corinth134/DSC01700.jpg

My next step is to clean with trisodium phosphate, acid etch, clean again, then paint. Then let it cure before filling with water. I might even get to swim in this before it's too cold this year!
 
  #15  
Old 09-04-07, 08:53 PM
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You have definately been doing some work, talk about DIY, congrats to you!

Whe you paint, depending on the paint you use, make sure to let cure about 5 days before filling.

GREAT JOB!!!
 
  #16  
Old 12-05-07, 03:19 PM
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Thumbs up painted

Just wanted to post a picture after it finally got painted.

Here is the pool repaired and painted. I used epoxy paint and it is very slippery under water but the surface is like a new pool!
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m...4/DSC01703.jpg

We actually got to use the pool before it got too cold too.

Hopefully, next season, it will be just as nice.
 
  #17  
Old 12-05-07, 03:29 PM
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GREAT JOB Almanon, looks great, you put the DIY in do it yourself... If you're in northern climate, make sure to winterize properly...
 
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