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any suggestions on type of caulk or sealant for flashing on door overhang

any suggestions on type of caulk or sealant for flashing on door overhang

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  #1  
Old 10-24-13, 12:09 PM
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any suggestions on type of caulk or sealant for flashing on door overhang

I have a problem with rotting wood in my door overhang resulting from water leaking behind the flashing, and I'm looking for suggestions of what to use to seal the opening. My home is located in south Florida about 6 miles from the coast.

I'm a real novice with do-it-yourself projects, but I have caulked my bathtub twice. My experience with caulking the tub has given me concerns over making sure that the repair job is waterproof. It's my understanding that silicone caulk does a better job of waterproofing than latex. I used latex in my first tub-caulking effort and had to replace the caulk because in less than 3 years it was separating and getting moldy. So I just recently recaulked with silicone and I'm hoping for a better and longer lasting job.

But I have a friend who used to work in construction and he recommends I use latex caulk because he says that the south Florida sun will dry out silicone caulk. Also, I have another friend who is an experienced do-it-yourselfer, and he told me that all caulk is waterproof and he's never heard that silicone is a better or longer lasting waterproofing material.

I've also heard that the type of surfaces involved affects the choice of caulk. I've attached pictures of the overhang. I've been told that the dark brown flashing is probably copper. The exterior of my home is stucco.

I'm wondering if there are better alternatives for insuring a waterproof seal. I'd use a sealant that costs 10 times as much if it were superior and was something that an inexperienced DIYer like me could do a good job with.

Painting over the caulk is not a concern since it's not visible from ground level. Other things I'm wondering about are how often I should recaulk and is it really necessary to remove the old caulk? My one friend said that it would be ok to just caulk over the old caulk. The area that needs caulking doesn't have easy access and removing the old stuff would make the job a lot tougher and bigger job based on my experience with removing the tub caulk.

What do you folks recommend?


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  #2  
Old 10-24-13, 01:52 PM
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Welcome to the forums! Silicone will die in direct sunlight. Latex caulk will die without paint or something to protect it, and it will shrink and crack. Use an elastomeric caulk, such as Big Stretch, or butyl rubber in a caulk tube. Either will stretch and shrink with temperature changes. But I forgot, you only have "hot" Elastomeric is the way to go over and above silicone and latex.
 
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Old 10-24-13, 06:54 PM
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Appears to be a nice job on the roof rafter details, I'm surprised the builder used any caulk with the metal flashing job... where will you be caulking? Does the existing flashing go behind the stucco?

Gary
 
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Old 10-24-13, 06:54 PM
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Thanks for the recommendation! I checked the Internet and found that Sashco makes Big Stretch caulk. The technical data on Sashco's site stated that it shouldn't be used with copper flashing and recommended their Lexel brand instead. The Lexel brand is also elastomeric so I'm thinking of using it. Do you have any experience with it?
Jim
 
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Old 10-24-13, 07:20 PM
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Gary,
I'll be caulking along the top of the flashing which runs left to right for about 5 or 6 feet along the overhang.

As far as I can tell, the flashing does not go behind the stucco. It appears to me that the lower part of the flashing is bent away from the wall and is sitting under the tiles. It's a little hard to see, but if you look closely at the top picture you'll notice that, on the far right, the flashing is bent away from the wall at a right angle and sits alongside the tile on the far right. I believe that a similar thing is going on with the lower end of the flashing--it's probably bent away from the wall and sitting under the tiles. (I know nothing about construction so this is all guesswork on my part.)
Jim
 
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Old 10-24-13, 09:05 PM
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I would recommend a polyurethane. Vulkem is one that's readily available. Cut a big nozzle and make a large bead. Its available in multiple colors, so pick one that's close to your stucco color. Ivory or Beige maybe.
 
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Old 10-25-13, 03:02 AM
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I'd go with XSleeper's recommendation. I have used Lexel many times. It is baaaad stuff. I believe it will cure under water. If you get it on you or your clothes it stays. It does seal, but you need to be very careful with it.
 
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Old 10-25-13, 01:12 PM
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Those "wings" of bent flashing (metal-painted BTW) are bent/cut to protect the raw ends of the stucco, used by someone who knew how to flash. The bent portion of the flashing (sits of roof) should go under the tiles (as pictured), onto the building paper below it. Here is where IMO your leak may be, unless the top edge of flashing is a "counter-flash" over the roof/wall flash, and you have a gap between them. If so, it shouldn't be caulked: rather be reinstalled with top of bottom r/w flash behind lip of upper counter-flash... very hard to see from here, lol. Called "cap flashing" (upper one) and "base flashing" here, similar but couldn't find a good diagram...; Chimney Flashing Detail

Does the bottom lip of upper flashing extend down 3/4" or so over the lower flashing---- I'm thinking it was never installed up/under the counter flash at start...On the upper flash (one under the stucco) how long is the metal down below the stucco?

Gary
 
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Old 10-25-13, 06:24 PM
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Thanks for the recommendation. What are the pros/cons for polyurethane caulk? Is it relatively easy to apply and does it do a good and long-lasting job of waterproofing? Do you think it will hold up well in the direct Florida sunlight?
Jim
 

Last edited by 555help; 10-25-13 at 06:41 PM.
  #10  
Old 10-25-13, 06:40 PM
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Gary,
Cap-flashing, base-flashing and counter-flashing are all new concepts to a beginner DIYer like me. I've looked at the diagram, but I'm a bit tired and can't make sense out of it. I'm working on Saturday, but I plan on getting my ladder out and taking another look at the area on Sunday or Monday and seeing if I can follow the diagram better. Thanks for your help.
Jim
 
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Old 10-25-13, 07:30 PM
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Polyurethanes are well suited for sealants that need to stick but also need to expand and contract in order to last. They bond well to metal and concrete (your stucco). Vulkem is easy to apply. As I mentioned, cut a wide nozzle, roughly 3/8" across, and try to neatly caulk the corner so that you spread the sealant equally on both surfaces.

As Gary seems to be alluding to, you may "think" the leak is in one place, and you can try caulking there to stop the leak, but in reality, the leak may be elsewhere. Good luck finding it.
 
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Old 10-26-13, 03:12 PM
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With a small porch roof having so much detail and quality work, I find it hard they used caulking where metal flashing would work so much better. With flashing I described, caulking shouldn't be included.... Correct as said, the leak is either: someone installed flashing without tucking it behind counter/upper flashing that goes behind the stucco (leak would be between the flashings near the top of metals, 2. lower flashing goes under the roofing paper to wet the sheathing------- easy enough to check; remove the top tiles after first checking to see if flashings are caulked together.

WHERE is the old caulking?

Gary
 
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Old 10-27-13, 11:44 AM
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Thanks XSleeper. Regarding where the location of the leak may be, I've definitely noticed what appears to me to be an exposed area where water can do some damage, but I'll keep in mind that the real culprit may be something else. See my next post for details about the area that I was thinking needs to be caulked.
Jim
 

Last edited by 555help; 10-27-13 at 01:34 PM.
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Old 10-27-13, 01:29 PM
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Gary,
Thanks for the additional information, but due to my inexperience and lack of knowledge, I'm having trouble understanding exactly what I should be looking for. As far as I can tell, there is only one piece of flashing, but maybe there is another. From what you're saying, it sounds like it could be embedded in the stucco, but how would I be able to tell?

I have seen something sticking out perpendicular from the stuccoed wall that I have been assuming is dried out caulking, but maybe it's actually the lip ("lip" is probably not the correct terminology) of embedded flashing. You might be able to make it out in the top photo. It runs in a line from left to right just above the whole length of the dark brown flashing. If I remember correctly, it sticks out about a quarter inch and is very stiff and might even be sharp-edged. It's as if the stuccoed wall has a very short, thin, and long fin (like a fish's fin). I've been assuming that it's old caulk, but maybe it's actually embedded flashing. The dark brown flashing does not sit right up flush against the wall. I've been assuming that it once was directly against the wall and then somehow bowed out a little. There is a gap between the brown flashing and what I've been assuming to be the old caulk. I was planning on caulking over that gap.

I'll get out my ladder tomorrow, take another look at the area, and take some photos of the area I'm talking about. Hopefully what I'm describing will be visible in the photos. I'll also take a photo of the wood damage and show where it is in relation to the flashing.

Jim
 
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Old 10-28-13, 08:32 AM
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I checked the area again and what I described in my previous post as a fish's fin running in a line just above the copper flashing really does appear to be a line of caulk/sealant. See the first three photos attached below. The first one shows the right end where the caulk is not separated, and the other two photos are from the left and middle where it's obviously separated.

I've also attached photos of the lower part of the flashing where it meets the apex of the overhang. They show what appears to be some kind of dark-colored sealant having been used there. At the bottom of the photos, you can see the tiles.

I've also attached a photo of the far left end of the flashing where you can see a vertical line of caulk attached to the flashing but separated from the wall's stucco.



Below are my thoughts about what I believe to be the problem:

The brown flashing does not sit right up flush against the wall and has separated from the caulking, especially at its center. I can push the flashing with my finger and it moves up against the wall. I'm guessing that, as my townhouse has settled over the years, the flashing bowed out a little and this resulted in it separating from the caulk. There is damage to the wood sitting directly below the midpoint area of the flashing and I think it's been caused by water entering the gap between the flashing and the separated caulk and seeping down to the wood.

I've attached two photos of the wood damage (one from closer up and another from a distance.) You can see that the damaged area is in the exact center.

I guess it's possible that the leak is coming from other areas including where the flashing meets the apex of the overhang.


I'm hoping that the job ahead of me just involves recaulking and then repairing the damaged wood with some wood hardener and wood filler. If so, should I remove the old caulk? If so, any advice about how to remove it and will it be a tough job? My concern is that if I don't do a good job, the problem will continue to exist and the wood will rot to the point where I'll have a really big job replacing the wood, etc.

Thanks to everyone for their input. This forum is great!

Jim
 
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Old 10-28-13, 09:35 AM
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With the different colored line going horizontally across the top of the flashing, I agree; the flashing was tucked under the stucco top coats and has since pulled out/down from the wall. Try slipping a short piece of new (flat-no lip) metal flashing up behind/under the stucco- at least the 1/4-1/2" original flash was originally installed, get behind the layer of builder's paper. If unable to do that, call a pro. They will cut stucco out 6" up, remove old and install new weep screed/flashing and re-stucco. If paper is too short (as appears in picture- cement visible below stucco coats), they should layer paper. Replace wood 2x as only tie-in to house. This is the BEST/most expensive way..... or just caulk as others said and hope for the best.

Gary
 
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Old 10-28-13, 02:49 PM
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Thanks Gary. I'll definitely consider getting a pro to do the job. Any idea of what it would cost roughly including replacing (rather than repairing) the wood? Also, is it pretty much a routine job or something that a contractor might screw up? Also, I'm confused over who to call to get estimates--is this a job that would be handled by one contractor, or am I going to need a roofing guy, a stucco guy, and a carpenter? I imagine the costs will really start to add up if I need several different contractors.

Jim
 
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Old 10-29-13, 03:51 PM
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Fairly simple job, though it involves some framing replacement. A General Contractor should have his carpenters do the framing, sub-contract the stucco/roofing, so you pay only him. Be sure to get a "lien release" from him, if used in your state, as they are in mine- to prevent any subs from billing you. Check references, local prices vary greatly from the U.S.

Gary
 
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Old 10-30-13, 07:42 AM
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Thanks Gary. (As I'm sure you can tell, I've never had to hire a contractor before.)
Jim
 
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