Pics sliding door leak

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Old 01-01-14, 11:20 AM
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Pics sliding door leak

Here are some pics. I have a sliding door on first floor. Just about to drywall the finished basement when I see this in the stud cavity of about 3 bays. I'll post the basement photos in a separate post. You can see a gap in the left side of the door could be where it's coming from? . A gap in the electric outlet on the left of door and on the right side of door Dish network drilled a hole through the beam and up through the deck and left it uncaulked. I later saw this down the road and caulked it from the inside.
My wife usually leaves the screen door open during rain and snow but I wouldn't think it would effect this. Pics in a few minutes.
 
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Old 01-01-14, 11:32 AM
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Here is a test picture to see if pics upload.
 
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Old 01-01-14, 11:55 AM
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[URL="[URL=http://s286.photobucket.com/user/moreira85/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps5fc955cf.jpg.html][/URL"][/URL
 
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Old 01-01-14, 12:02 PM
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The outlet is 18 inches left of the door. U can see the hole from dish network.

[URL=http://s286.photobucket.com/user/moreira85/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsd97596a8.jpg.html][/URL

[URL=http://s286.photobucket.com/user/moreira85/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps79f219f0.jpg.html][/URL
 
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Old 01-01-14, 12:02 PM
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pix helped, but inside ones would tell the tale.
 
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Old 01-01-14, 12:07 PM
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Yep I'm working on it. Be up in 5
 
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Old 01-01-14, 12:28 PM
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Here are pics starting with the left side of the door where the gap is and the outlet to the left. It's labelled as right gap because I'm in the basement



 
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Old 01-01-14, 12:31 PM
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Pictures of middle of slider
 
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Old 01-01-14, 12:35 PM
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These are pics of the right hand side of the sliding door. You can see the wires above and this is where that hole you saw in the deck was drilled through. Water got through the hole and I later caulked it from inside.


 
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Old 01-01-14, 12:38 PM
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The black marker lines are where the slider door starts and ends.
 
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Old 01-01-14, 02:15 PM
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I'm hoping for some good news here.

When I look under the j channel it appears it was flashed correctly. I realized where dish drilled the hole on the right side of the door I only caulked the inside in the basement. I just realized there's an interior osb between the floor joist and an exterior osb. This means water was probably working its way down the whole then seeping between the osb boards. I took some more measurements and it appears that the water was getting in behind the elec outlet on the other side of door. Right below the outlet in the basement is where the osb is rotted. Looks like the mildew mold started there and spread. I guess I have to figure out how to clean this up and how to get this outlet sealed yo the house ? Then test with a hose.
 
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Old 01-01-14, 03:37 PM
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Inside, pull the insulation that is between the floor joists so that you can get a look at the areas directly below the door. Looking below the top plate on the basement wall leaves you the whole floor joist short of the door height.

Can you get some pictures from under the deck?

Can you take some pictures of the complete door from the outside? Can you peel back the siding at the j-channel at the top left and right of the door exterior and tell if any tape was used to seal the door?

You may want to remove the trim board below the door to look to see if there is a pan of any type located under the door itself. It would also give access to sealing the hole the dish people left.
 
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Old 01-01-14, 05:06 PM
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I will get some more pics up from underneath the deck and at the j channels. Not sure if they used tape I'll check. I'll prob wait for spring when it's warmer so I can pull the siding off. I did pull down the insulation between the floor joists but I couldn't get a good look because there's a second osb board on the inside completely dry between the joist that covers what you really want to see.
 
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Old 01-01-14, 06:05 PM
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I'm gonna try replacing the weatherproof outlet first to see if that helps. When the builder installed it they stripped one side so the right side of the outlet has always hung out from the siding.
 
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Old 01-01-14, 06:37 PM
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There could be multiple things going on and we really can't tell without being there to remove siding and look. Having said that, you have large quantities of water being caught in the bottom j-channel, and the only place it can escape is right at the corners of the patio door. So that large quantity of water in that one spot is putting a lot of water in an already difficult to seal area.

So number one... open up your vinyl siding at one of the seams (butt joints) and look in behind the siding. See if there is any housewrap behind the siding. If there is, that's good. If there is not, that's bad.

Next, pull the j-channel away from the door, someplace where it is already kind of loose and gappy, pulling it just enough to look in behind it a little. You will see part of the nailing fin of the patio door. Hopefully you would also see that the nailing fin has been covered with a peel & stick window and door flashing. If there is no window flashing tape over the nailing fin, water could be getting in at that location. That's something that could be added if you wanted to remove all the siding around the door. (not THAT hard)

Finally a third question mark is the way the bottom of the door is sealed underneath that 2x6 trim. Less likely, since the majority of water seems to be right at the ends of the door (blame the j-channel). If you were going to remove the siding around the door in order to tape the fin, it would become obvious whether or not that bottom 2x6 trim below the door should also come off in order to make sure the WRB is completely intact.

Water is obviously getting behind the WRB somewhere or else all that water would have stayed outside. It's obvious water has gotten behind the WRB at some point since you see the evidence inside. My guess is that it's from the water in the bottom j-channel.

Which brings us to the last thing, and that's the deck ledger flashing. The deck ledger should be flashed and should be behind the WRB. That ledger flashing needs to be continuous under the entire door, and water running down the WRB, j-channel, or nailing fin should not be able to run behind it.

Only way to check that is to remove some siding. (again, not that hard.) When you go to remove the siding, the bottom edge simply unzips. To hook the siding back up you can use a siding unlock tool. Malco Sideswiper is one brand. They are kind of hard to find in stores, but are readily available online.

Outlets can leak, and that might be "part" of the problem, but it would be a very MINOR amount of water compared to what's being dumped out the end of the horizontal j-channel along the deck, as mentioned above. But even if the outlet was mounted nicely (set against the sheathing, surrounded by a siding mounting block) you would still have leak potential around the entire perimeter of the mounting block. With vinyl siding, things like that are EXPECTED to leak, and all you can do is make sure the WRB sheds the water as it is supposed to. Many guys will also add metal flashings as the siding is installed to direct the majority of the water back out again by shedding the bottom edge of the additional metal flashing out over the nailing flange of the first course of siding below the penetration, which directs that water out to the vinyl siding weep holes ASAP.
 
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Old 01-01-14, 07:17 PM
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Wow a lot of info xsleeper. Ill start with question 1. There is house wrap behind the siding. Ill take a closer look at the j channel tomorrow. When I peeled away and looked under the j channel I could see the house wrap coming out the bottom of the j channel. So when I pull out the j channel I'm looking for tape?
 
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Old 01-01-14, 07:28 PM
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Glad to hear there is housewrap. The next question is if there are any gaps or seams in it, and whether it is lapped properly to shed water. Some guys do a poor job of that around the corners of doors. Housewrap should be under the nailing fin of the door. Butyl flashing tape over the nailing fin and onto the housewrap.

When I peeled away and looked under the j channel I could see the house wrap coming out the bottom of the j channel.
I don't know what you mean there? Coming out the bottom?
 
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Old 01-01-14, 08:45 PM
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So I should pull back the j channel along the deck floor at the corners of slider and the j channel that runs up the side of the door? the house wrap should be under the metal fin of the door and then tape over the metal fin?
 
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Old 01-01-14, 09:07 PM
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You will need to remove all the siding as well as the j-channel in order to tape the vinyl nailing fin. I am just saying to peek behind there before you rip it ALL off. I don't see any way to fix this leak without removing at least some siding. (if the nailing fin is taped, you would probably only need to remove the bottom 2 rows of siding. But if the nailing fin is not taped, I'd probably remove all the siding around the door so that I could tape it all.)

Once the siding is off, the spot water is coming in will probably be obvious. If the inside of the OSB looks like that the outside of the OSB will look even worse. It's probably all black and punky behind the housewrap on that lower left corner of the door.

Once the bottom j-channel is off, you will be able to clearly see if there is a deck ledger flashing.
 
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Old 01-01-14, 09:16 PM
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Thanks for the help. Appreciate it. Lots of snow tomorrow so I'll check it out as soon as I can and report back. J channels are nailed in but you said I should be able to peek under?
 
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Old 01-01-14, 09:31 PM
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Yes, if the nails are, say 16" apart, the j-channel will flex enough that you should be able to "feel" where the nails are holding the j-channel securely... so pick a spot between the nails and pull it slightly away from the door and peek. It might only open up 1/4" or so. But be careful and don't pry too hard, they get brittle when it's cold. Sorry about the snow.
 
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