Termidor perimeter treatment - how far fr building is OK?


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Old 06-11-24, 03:45 PM
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Termidor perimeter treatment - how far fr building is OK?

I have drainage problems for an old house squatting with the sill on grade. Besides rotting the structure, the basement floods in hard rain. There is little/no grade slope and I cannot lower grade. I will be doing a couple things:
- To get some clearance under the sill, a tiled "dry moat" around the building trenched 8" or so below grade
- a "ground roof" of EPDM roofing installed to the foundation wall just below the dry moat and sloping about 1/2" per ft away from the building for five feet. Backfilling etc to grade on completion.
- various gutter and drywell installations

Clearly this is not something termite control guys usually deal with and I would like some input from anybody with info on specific details about exactly what matters when applying termiticides. I have spent a couple hours getting an overview from google and best I can tell the main deal is:
- continuous around the building
- depth to 2" below top of the footing (or 2' minimum below grade, but that sounds, well, minimal
- avoid poison runoff and spreading toward any of a number of sensitive locations

Under slab is less clear because it seems to me that the perimeter treatment should protect the enclosed (under slab) space. Soil type and various other stuff matter but not my main question here.

I don't want to breach the "ground roof" but that makes it impossible to get the poison deeper than the membrane. I read an idea that basically said "expand the perimeter" (it referenced walks, patios, decks, etc). That sorta makes sense - just do the treatment 5' away from the house, just clear my "ground roof" membrane. And yeah, I could pre-treat before the drainage work, but if I understand correctly, I'll be doing this again in 7-10 years or so and the years go by quickly..

So what's wrong with that concept? All ears here... <g>

Thx
RJ
 
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Old 06-12-24, 07:22 AM
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Interesting issue. I suspect that the pros have treated properties with hidden drainage tiles, waterproofing, bentonite barriers, etc without even knowing it due to homeowners death, old age, multiple re-sales, etc. Termidor, or the active ingredient: fipronil, is the best termiticide in many opinions. The fact that it's non-repellent means you don't have to have a perfect, continuous barrier, though it's desirable to try for that. The termites won't probe and move around looking for a weak spot, as they would with a repellent termiticide.

Five feet would feel far to me, but then I was on the hook for warranty/re-treatment, too. If one is using the five rule to go around patios, etc, I would think that they are only using the five foot rule in that area, meaning the rest of the house for the most part is treated up against the foundation. I would suggest pre-treating, as you mentioned, before doing the drainage pipe/umbrella installation and not remove the treated soil to the extent possible. Be prepared to spot re-treat as you install the system, if needed. Treating prior to installation is the best window of opportunity to put the termiticide where it belongs and will do the best. Unless you are in Virginia or further south, it is not automatic that you will need to re-treat.

Have you learned about/considered using borates as a direct wood spray in the basement, to all exposed wooden structural members, as an adjunct to the soil perimeter treatment? Will add cost, but borates last for many years when done properly and add another layer of protection from termites and act as remediation/prevent for mold and fungus. Bora-care and Tim-bor are the biggest brand names, but there are generics with the same active ingredient. I wouldn't rely on borates only, but would be a valuable adjunct to soil treatment. Damp wood is ideal to treat with borates, as the borates are actually drawn into the wood faster and deeper than on dry woods. With the Tim-Bor powder you can actually make direct application to sills, etc assuming basement is unfinished and the esthetics of seeing white powder isn't an issue. Before we finished our one basement wall and before pole barn interior walls were covered, I applied Tim-Bor powder to all the sills as a dry powder, not water mix. Though retired now, I always have a Tim-Bor bucket of powder on hand.

Taurus SC is a good generic Termidor. We used it a lot and suffered no more or less warranty issues.

Do a search for "termite reticulation system", "termite piping system" and similar. Could be a system that you could install along with the drainage piping/umbrella so that re-treatment in the future, if necessary, could be performed by treating into above ground pipes which disperse around the house. I've only ever seen and treated into one system that a pretty smart electrician devised around his house. It sure appeared to work as far as dispersion.

I'm going to be out of touch for a day or two but will be thinking more about the issue.
 
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Old 06-12-24, 03:37 PM
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PAbugman
Thx

After spending a couple hours, I can say the "termite reticulation" is not a responsive search item. A lot of words and very little actual info. About half the sites come from Termipor, and Indian pipe supplier. There is basically no USA sites or chatter. Google results turned weird quickly so I shifted to Duck. Here is a dump of sites that had _some_ info:

https://www.pes-tec.com/images/peste...ti-Termite.pdf

https://www.slideserve.com/Termipore...termite-system

https://www.facebook.com/10006377651...47159873241115

https://issuu.com/termiporepipes/doc..._reticulatio/4

https://www.slideserve.com/TERMIPORE...culation-pipes

https://diypestcontrol.com/b-g-profe...-termite-pipes

https://www.reddit.com/user/TermiPor...ur_lldp_pipes/

https://buildersjournal.blogspot.com...i-termite.html

Sorry for the mess, but there is very little actual info in them - it takes looking at all to get a clue. It looks like this is something commonly done in India and probably other high pressure areas. Like Australia.

Flow rates? Pipe sizes? Emitters? Holes (even)? Porous pipe? What's a "junction box"? What destroys pipes (looks like termites do damage pipes)?

Looks like PE tube is the go-to and HDPE is common.

Anyway... That appears to be a majorly good approach when one can't just apply into ground around a building easily. Or when you need to re-up the treatment more frequently. Maybe it'll catch on in the Southern states someday.

Onward.
RJ
 
 

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