Clean water leak only when flushing toilet.

Reply

  #1  
Old 07-24-13, 03:48 AM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 34
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Clean water leak only when flushing toilet.

Hi everyone, I've been having this leak for a month now and I just can't figure out where is coming from.
I assume it is the drainage pipe but why don't I also get dirty water?
This is what I figured so far. If I shut off water to the toilet I have no leaks. As soon as I flush, the leak starts again and then stops after a while...it just drips for a couple of hours from my kitchen ceiling.
I added some food colorant to the tank and bowl and it matches the color of the water that leaks so I have no doubt this is the issue.
I am tempted to cut the stucco from the ceiling so I can confirm this and replace the pipe but I wanted to run it by the forum first just in case you have a better suggestion. I just don't understand why it only leaks clean water.
By the way, I replaced the wax ring just in case and it made no difference. I also didn't see anything obviously wrong with the flange and pipe.
The house was built in 1966. I am the second owner so I am not sure if the pipe was ever serviced. It is definitely metal. I didn't see any PVC.
Thank you in advance for your help.
 
  #2  
Old 07-24-13, 04:30 AM
chandler's Avatar
Banned. Rule And/Or Policy Violation
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 39,965
Received 6 Votes on 6 Posts
What you propose is spot on. Remove a section of the ceiling to see what is happening. The ceiling is ruined anyway, so no loss there, and it can be repaired. Let us know what you find out from your investigation. Has the bathroom been tiled on top of backer board since you moved in? Was an extension ring installed? If so, was it siliconed in place?
 
  #3  
Old 07-24-13, 05:50 AM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 34
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Thank you Chandler. In answer to your questions, no changes to the bathroom floor since I moved in 8 years ago. No extension ring added. I can tell the flange in place has silicone all around it.
I went ahead and removed the drywall right below the drain pipe. What a mess. I flushed the toilet again and I can tell it is coming from the flange/downpipe area...I just don't have a straight view of it. So now what? Do they make some kind of sleep I can just slip in the pipe and be done with it? The access to the pipe from underneath is very tight so I don't think I would be able to repair myself. Picture attached. Thank you again for your help.
 
Attached Images  
  #4  
Old 07-24-13, 07:48 AM
J
Banned. Rule And/Or Policy Violation
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 4,294
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Ok, where on the pipe is it leaking?
Many times I've seen those old copper drains leak from corrosion. Most of the time it's right along the bottom.
Hard to tell from that picture, but is that water dripping down from the floor joist onto the pipe, no the pipe itself leaking?
Did you check the tank to bowl seal?
 
  #5  
Old 07-24-13, 02:40 PM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 34
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
It is leaking from the pipe. Tank to bowl seal is fine.
I cut off more drywall and I can see this was an issue way back with the previous owners and they just "sealed" it with some kind of black tar. It looks terrible. It is the toilet downpipe. I still don't understand why it only leaks clean water. Anyway, I think I might be over my head here. Seems to be something I should leave to an experienced plummer. You all agree or should I start cutting pipe? I am pretty handy but don't have much experience with plumbing, and the space is really tight. Thank you again for your help.
 
Attached Images      
  #6  
Old 07-24-13, 03:30 PM
chandler's Avatar
Banned. Rule And/Or Policy Violation
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 39,965
Received 6 Votes on 6 Posts
To go against all we are here for on the forum, with the tightness of the location, copper pipes, how it was shoddily repaired, it may be beyond the DIY spectrum for you to proceed. I would find a highly recommended plumber to come take a look at what you have to make an assessment.
 
  #7  
Old 07-24-13, 03:43 PM
lawrosa's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Galivants Ferry SC USA
Posts: 18,154
Received 62 Votes on 54 Posts
Yes pipe cut, toilet pulled, replace pipe and toilet flange with PVV..

Need a mission coupling that converd copper OD with PVC OD...

If this is something you dont think you can do... call a plumber..

Get a few estimates... Cheaper is not always better, but watch out for the rip offs...

Post here for any advice...

Repair will not be cheap... I say $700 range but your prices may vary...
 
  #8  
Old 07-26-13, 10:29 AM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 34
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Thank you again. I went ahead and called a plumber a friend of mine recommended. He opened a larger hole as you can see on the picture. Looks like he'll cut off the copper pipe and will replace with a Fernco mission coupler as you suggested. I cleaned up the elbows edges so he can get a better seal all around. Looks like the brass elbows are in good shape. At first he thought a new PVC elbow and flange was going to be needed and wasn't sure if he would have enough space...thought it would be approximately $250. Now looks like just replacing the copper pipe will do it. He'll come back Monday to do the work. We'll see how much he'll charge me. Super nice guy and knowledgeable.
Next thing will be the drywall. The whole kitchen ceiling needs to be redone...about 12x12. It has 3 pendants and 6 recessed lights. We'll see how much that will be. I'll post here once I have more updates. Thank you again everyone.
 
Attached Images   
  #9  
Old 07-29-13, 10:20 AM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 34
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
UPDATE: Leak fixed. Flange, elbow, and pipe had to be replaced. Took him 3 hours and charged me $350. Super nice and knowledgeable person. Will definitely use him again.
Now moving on to the drywall issue.
Thank you all for your help!
 
Attached Images  
  #10  
Old 07-29-13, 12:33 PM
lawrosa's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Galivants Ferry SC USA
Posts: 18,154
Received 62 Votes on 54 Posts
That fernco rubber coupling he used is not to code AFAIK...

Hope he did not put that over the hub of the elbow...Must be a banded no hub coupling per code...

That will leak IMO.. especially on the hub end...

Here is an example... ( And probably needs to be a mission type because of the different OD of the pipes...)

This guy did you injustice IMO..


 
  #11  
Old 07-29-13, 12:55 PM
D
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 34
Received 0 Votes on 0 Posts
Good to know. I'll run it by him. I checked the coupler and he did install the clamp pass the hub of the elbow. Thank you again.
 
  #12  
Old 07-29-13, 02:00 PM
lawrosa's Avatar
Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Galivants Ferry SC USA
Posts: 18,154
Received 62 Votes on 54 Posts
I checked the coupler and he did install the clamp pass the hub of the elbow.
Like I said... Cant do that and its just bad plumbing practices..

FYI a no hub has a stop in the middle that make no difference in pipe size internally.


What needed to be dont is the old copper removed from that brass ellbow then a new short piece of copper installed/soldered... Then a copper x PVC no hub..

Looks like he'll cut off the copper pipe and will replace with a Fernco mission coupler as you suggested.

Not what he did... Oh and maryland follows the same code as NJ.....

4.3.8 here...

New Jersey Plumbing Code
 
 

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
 
Ask a Question
Question Title:
Description: