Need advice on toilet purchase

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Old 09-03-16, 03:02 PM
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Need advice on toilet purchase

My "new to me" home has horrible inadequate toilet. It has very weak flush so doesn't handle solid waste without clogging. Never saw a toilet like this with very different tank mechanism. Home Depot sells these as "Glacier Bay" and this one costs $39. Looks like some 3rd world flusher.

Here's link to video of flushing mechanism. https://youtu.be/SAasKjil4Bg

I need advice on what tiolet to buy to replace this piece of junk. Want one with good strong flush, wider outlet to handle solid waste without chronic clogging but don't need dual flush. And don't want noisy pressure assist.

Considering Toto DrakeŽ Two-Piece Toilet, 1.6 GPF, ADA Compliant, Elongated Bowl but a bit pricey. Is there a comparable American Standard or other big name toilet brands you might recommend a bit cheaper?
 
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Old 09-03-16, 03:09 PM
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Looks to me like the water saver feature is the issue, is it possible to remove it and use the tank like it was originally intended?
 
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Old 09-03-16, 03:20 PM
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Do not know whether standard flush system can be installed? Haven't pulled out bucket to see what is under it (does it have holes for universal fill and overflow valve of correct size and location? Flapper?? ) Flush handle is on left side of tank, not on front upper corner.
 
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Old 09-03-16, 03:28 PM
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It looks like a normal tank that had been retrofitted to use less water - which is likely the problem. I think most modern tanks now use 1.5 gallons which I'm sure would do better than the current set up .... but I'm just a painter, the plumbers should be along later.
 
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Old 09-03-16, 06:12 PM
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Looks like something advertised on late night TV, "and the first 500 callers get a free roll of toilet paper".

I have always thought if you want different the way to go was a pressure toilet. https://www.flushmate.com/howitworks/
 
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Old 09-03-16, 07:33 PM
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My issue with pressure is that most older toilets have smaller flush valve (2") and narrower trap-way with sharper angle turns. Adding pressure to LARGE solid waste isn't going to push it through.

The Toto Drake has 3 inch flush valve and bigger and straighter trap design. Things just go. There's a YouTube video where guy flushed 24 golf balls at once. Don't think pressure would do that on standard design trap and flush valve.
 
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Old 09-06-16, 08:15 AM
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American Standard Champion IV. 1.28 gallons per flush. Installed one last fall at the endorsement of many here and I've been pleased with it. Came from Home Depot, by the way.
 
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Old 09-06-16, 10:01 AM
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We are about to buy new toilets next week so I have been following this thread. I googled the toilet & done some reading. I have to say, I really got a hearty chuckle out of the online description from American Standard:

"The Champion 4 MAX toilet from American Standard offers superior flushing performance, moving a 70% larger mass than the industry norm to virtually eliminate clogging. It’s a water efficient toilet, too, with a low 1.28 gallon per flush rate to help you save water without sacrificing performance. The 16-1/2” Right Height design and elongated bowl make for a much more comfortable experience. Comes with our revolutionary EverClean surface to help inhibit the growth of mold, mildew, and bacteria that stains and causes odors for a toilet that is impeccably clean."

I truly do realize they have to choose their wording carefully when promoting such a device but.... that was just funny to me.

Thanks Stickshift for your post, its much appreciated. I will make a note of it to look for this one at Home Depot.
 
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Old 09-06-16, 02:21 PM
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"Right height" not for everyone

The idea of "right height" toilets may lead you to buy wrong height. The ADA compliant toilets are 17" from floor. Standard height usually 14.5". So an average height adult would be comfortable at 17". But I am only 5'1" so 17" is not right height for me. Also, children will not do well with 17" high seat. So before you buy, think about grandkids and other children who may be using that toilet. 17" might be ok for master bathroom if adults 5'4" and taller. If you have kids or frequent visitors who have kids or are vertically-challenged adults, keep a standard height toilet in 2nd bathroom.

Also, the elongated bowl shape is fine for adults but small kids will struggle with the larger opening. And could make potty training nightmare if toddler feels he/she will or does fall in.

So always take into account others who live or visit frequently in buying decision.
 
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Old 09-06-16, 02:27 PM
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The Champion 4 max costs about $75 more than Toto Drake at Home Depot. Another issue is that the special antimicrobial surface can be damaged if you clean with harsh or abrasive cleaners.
 
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Old 09-06-16, 02:38 PM
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FemaleDIY,

Good post and good points. You put into words what I thought.

Although the Champion 4 toilet is very good and I do promote it, be careful with the manufactures claims. The toilet will only perform as good as the weakest link in the system. If your pipes are old and restricted from yeas of use (many metal or clay pipes), a Champion 4 won't do what you expect. Just as any other toilet won't do it. Also the elongated toilets are becoming more popular but they also take up more room. That extra 2 or 3 inches can be a problem in a spare bathroom or the 1st floor half bath.

When I sell a toilet in our store I try to convince the customer to try it out. Sit on it and see it it's comfortable. I especially tell this to the older folks like myself. Remember, its the most important seat in the house.

Another point to consider is the two stage flush toilets. One handle push flushes about 1/2 tank full for liquid. Extended or second flush will empty complete tank for solids. This is not important in the Northeast (in fact you may have problems finding a two stage) but in the Southwest it might be mandatory. Although the Northeast and the Great Lakes does not have a water problem I like the two stage system. The single flush is quick and less noisy. Especially nice at night. Less chance of waking sleeping family members.
 
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Old 09-06-16, 03:01 PM
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Champ 4 is a good toilet and unique flush mechanism dumps a lot of water fast down a big throat so a powerful flush. I have installed dozens of Mansfield toilets in hotels that operate fine and never had an issue. Upgrade the fill valve from the ball float to a Fluidmaster 400 and you will still save money over the top of the line. Keep in mind that the hotel toilets get a ton of use and have never had issues that they have complained about. Mansfield also comes in comfort and regular height as well as round and elongated.
 
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Old 09-06-16, 03:51 PM
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All toilet manufacturers produce a line of products that range from just okay to much better than just okay. My sister had three "Mansfield" toilets in her house and they were the lowest performing model. They would plug on a regular basis or else require multiple flushing to clear. When she moved in I had one replaced with a Toto Eco-Drake (1.28 gallons per flush) that had both the ADA height and the elongated bowl. This is in the bathroom that her adult son uses.

This last year or so I followed through on a promise to replace the toilet in her "mahster" bathroom and this time she preferred the standard Drake with lower height and the round bowl. She has never complained about either of these toilets but she did ask about the pricing of the Drakes as some day she will decide to replace the last of the Mansfields.

I had a well-rated local plumber do the work as his installation cost was quite reasonable as well as selling the Toto at a discounted price. There was no way that I was going to schlep the new toilets upstairs, the old ones downstairs and then get rid of the old toilets, all of which was covered in the installation fee.

For my own house I opted for the Toto Carlyle because I preferred the look and ease of cleaning with a one-piece toilet. As I age I am beginning to wish I had bought an ADA height toilet but so far no real complaints.
 
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Old 09-06-16, 04:09 PM
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Plumber I had out today for other issues told me he would remove funky flusher in my house and install any toilet for $150, about 1 hours labor. Is that reasonable cost and time estimate? I was very satisfied with work he did today so will likely have him install my Toto Drake 1.6 gpf elongated standard height which sells through Home Depot for $230 (does not include seat).
 
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Old 09-06-16, 04:19 PM
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As I recall he charged $159 for the installation. This being in the greater Seattle area all prices for everything are higher than the national averages. Looking at his website he is now advertising a price of $175 for removal, disposal and replacement. Your prices and time estimate sound quite reasonable to me.
 
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Old 09-06-16, 05:32 PM
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I don't think I want to remove the retrofit on this toilet. It is a 3 gpf recycle. I would be using twice as much water as legal limit of 1.6 gpf legislated in 1992. The savings in my water bill over time might pay for the new toilet. And wasting water just doesn't seem right.
 
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Old 09-06-16, 10:07 PM
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I would advise replacing the toilet with the retro-fit water saver. The first generation of water saving toilets performed poorly to very poorly and the same is true of any toilet that was retro-fitted to save water. Toilets today are computer designed to flush efficiently with a minimum amount of water. My water consumption dropped significantly when I replaced the original toilets with the 1.6 gpf models.
 
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Old 01-21-17, 03:19 AM
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I think you should definitely replace your toilet if you think that its not suitable then take the guidance of any professional person, and you should get it changed.
 
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Old 01-21-17, 04:17 AM
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Welcome to the DIY forum, Kathleen.

Please share with us how and why you came to us with this particular thread.
 
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Old 01-21-17, 06:26 AM
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As a Plumber I only install,

1 AS champ 4's ( 10 year warranty, fully galzed trapway, 4" flapper, etc
2 toto
3 Kohler highlines

I have all AS champ 4's in my own home. Ive been a plumber 30+ years..
 
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Old 01-23-18, 02:50 AM
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TOTO is best. Its a far better than American Standard.The Toto has not had one problem. it has a quick flush and is less noisy than the American Standard. It has really very high flushing capacity, For this reason, the toilets are known for not clogging as often as standard toilets. For this side, TOTOs are different from other toilets. Personally, I love it. So I can suggest you go with the Toto Drake it can fill your complete requirements.
 
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