Pop Up Drain Replacement

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  #1  
Old 10-25-17, 03:35 PM
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Pop Up Drain Replacement

The pop up drain in the bathroom was 20+ yrs old and was rusted and corroded. .
Basically fell apart when I was removing it.

I got it out and need to replace with a new one.

Questions.
in the pic, what is the gray plastic ring going around the drain?

Also, looks like some kind of plastic setting in the drain area.

I tried removing it but it looks to be part of the drain?

Eventually we are getting the bathroom remolded, so i don't need a high end pop up..
Any recommendations?

thanks
 
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  #2  
Old 10-25-17, 05:05 PM
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HD and Lowes (any hardware store) sell replacement pop ups, here's a link just as an example:
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Keeney-Univ...in-Kit/1059287

I don't know what the plastic piece is, I know I've never seen one and it probably doesn't belong. The top mess is probably dried up caulk and needs cleaned off. Some caulk gets very hard with age.
If your sink is china, all you should see is china.

If the new pop up fits through the hole, maybe you shouldn't mess with removing anything since the sink will be replaced later.
 
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Old 10-25-17, 09:06 PM
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Don't try to pull it out! It is a part of the sink drain casting.

Also when you get the popup, make sure it fits the indent in the sink and has a slope from the outer circumference to the drain. It should have a thin edge as well. The plastic ones with the crimped on metal trim (brass, chrome, bronze, etc) are too thick and will leave a raised lip in the sink. Then you have to wipe it out after each use or the standing water will discolor the drain and sink....ask me how I know.
 
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Old 10-26-17, 06:36 PM
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The plastic ring you note is an integral part of the vanity and needs to remain. It should not interact with your drain replacement in anyway.
 
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Old 10-27-17, 01:09 PM
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I purchased this one
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Keeney-Univ...in-Kit/1059287

Also, part two will be to replace the faucet. As you can see, thsi one is in bad shape.
I don't want a high end one as we eventually may have the bathroom remodeled in about 5 yrs.
I assume a standard type will fit?

I also think i may need a new compression shut off valve or will the one in the pic be ok?
 
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  #6  
Old 10-27-17, 02:32 PM
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Yeah, looks like a standard 4" spread bath faucet and the valve looks ok to me. Threads are clean and no damage to the mating surface. That little bit of verdigris is common. You could clean it up with a little vinegar and a brush, but I wouldn't bother.
 
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Old 10-27-17, 03:05 PM
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Excellent,

can i use clear silicone (like this link) to put around the base holes in the sink prior to putting the plastic/rubber plate down?
https://www.lowes.com/pd/GE-Silicone...-Caulk/3102449

I assume i need 3/8 water supply lines?
 
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Old 10-27-17, 03:13 PM
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Depends on what the instructions say. I've seen no sealant for one that have a more pliable rubber gasket and I've seen silicone for hard plastic baseplates.

Yeah, looks like 3/8" for the valves but could be 7/16" also. Plumbers do weird things sometimes. In fact...looking at it again, I think 7/16ths may be likely. What the other end will be depends on the faucet. It may have lines already attached or it may have threaded stubs...dunno til you buy it. Should say what's needed. Just take the old parts with you and get the same sizes.
 
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Old 10-27-17, 03:21 PM
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ok..
I was looking at this type because we have two sinks in the vanity and i was hoping to get close to the same type to match the other one, which is in a lot better shape

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Project-Sou...cet/1000079839

also, the reason i asked about the shut off valve, i had a hard tine turning it off..had to use pb blaster. When turning it off, i noticed a drip or two of water at the knob..

I supposed i can try the old one and if it leaks, replace it?
 
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Old 10-27-17, 04:07 PM
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Tighten the packing nut if it is leaking around the knob. It is the nut that is directly behind the shut off handle.

Use Plumbers putty under your new faucets, its cheap and easy to work with, no silicone please.

This in advance, if a bathroom remodel is in the picture, spend the extra money now to get the faucets you want that can be transferred to the new sinks post remodel.
 
  #11  
Old 10-27-17, 05:32 PM
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Well, that faucet comes with a popup...so if you just meant a similar one, that's fine. Why pay for another popup?

I hate to disagree with a Pro, but if the instructions say silicone or not, use what they say. Like I said, some say nothing because the gasket should seal just fine if the surface is undamaged. You don't put gasket maker AND an o-ring gasket on your head or exhaust on an engine unless that's what's called for.

I also have to disagree about upgrading the faucet in anticipation of remodel. Your tastes may change, styles may change, and do you really want a 5, 6, 7, 8 y/o (you know how things get pushed back) fixture in a brand new re-do?

On the valve, if you just got a drip or two while turning it off, that's pretty common. The stem packing dries out a bit and takes a set since it's just been sitting open for probably years. If it seals closed and doesn't leak when opened with the new faucet, I'd just tighten it a bit as mentioned. Since you aren't removing the vanity top, the job's going to be the same pita now or later.
 
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Old 10-27-17, 08:55 PM
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Your angle stop looks like standard 3/8" compression. Once you connect your new faucet, open the valve fully and inspect for leaks from the stem.
The valve should definitely be replaced when you start your remodel.

I would agree to hold off on getting an upgraded faucet until the time comes. Even a faucet guaranteed for life can show wear after 5 years if not kept clean.
 
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Old 10-28-17, 05:40 AM
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I have to agree with Gunguy and not Czizzi about the silicon sealing. If it's a china sink then plumbers putty is the way to go. If it's the "plastic" (can't think of the proper name) then use silicon (plumbers putty may stain the surface).

I also agree with Gunguy on the update of faucets. If you do infact remodel in 5 to 7 years then why not get all brand new fixtures? It's a much nicer feeling. And styles do change.
 
  #14  
Old 10-28-17, 07:42 AM
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Thanks,.....after speaking with the boss of the house, all of the comments on holding off on the upgrade faucet sounds right! She said this
may not happen for 4+ years down the road.

Don't know the type of sink (china or what ever .in the pics, it shows some white materiel like caulk, I had to use a putty knife to get it off) .

Sink was was put in the house in 1992 when it was built... Some videos show using plumbers putty, some silicone, some only the gasket/plate... as gunguy states,,,i will see what the instructions say....
 
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Old 10-28-17, 08:48 AM
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As Czizzi posted above, no silicone is required.
Just place putty around the perimeter (underside) of the plastic gasket and install the faucet. The excess putty will squeeze out and can be easily trimmed off. I use a scratch awl.
I've been installing faucets for 17 years and never used silicone once.

The more expensive faucets like Moen, Delta, Kohler include pliable or sponge washers that do not require any putty.
 
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Old 10-29-17, 12:00 PM
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thanks

wife and I stopped at lowes...she picked not one but two..said we need to replace both after 25yrs!

the pic shows a plastic mounting gasket that goes under the faucet onto the sink under, but instructions don't say anything about using putty.

The instruction say to use silicone under the pop up flange but i have plumbers putty.which should work?

The sales guy at lowes also said to use Pipe Thread Sealant for the thread connections in the pop up, supply lines threads and thread on the lockouts that connect the faucet to the sink

Any other areas for applying the Pipe Thread Sealant i should consider?
 
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Old 10-29-17, 12:13 PM
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If the sink is cultured marble, do not use plumbers putty. If it's porcelain then putty is OK. If the surface level with no imperfections then just the supplied gasket should be OK.
 
  #18  
Old 10-29-17, 12:32 PM
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Not sure of the sink type...

in one of the post below, there was a pic of the faucet area after i removed the old one.

this is a pic after clean up...
 
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Old 10-29-17, 12:37 PM
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I'm thinking cultured marble. They say plumbers putty will leave a stain.The surface absorbs the oils. For the drain I would use the silicon and just the gasket provided by the faucet company.
 
  #20  
Old 10-29-17, 12:45 PM
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ok,,i don't have any silicone handy,,,,,

this sink will be removed during our bathroom remodel in 4-5 yrs .
 
  #21  
Old 10-29-17, 05:03 PM
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Take that plastic drain assembly and toss it in the garbage. Get an all brass one and save them for the new remodel. I have installed multiple dozens of sinks and usually toss the plastic drain assembly out or donate them to Habitat for humanity. I only save one and use it in extreme emergency situations. As others have noted, no silicone, use plumbers putty. Not sure why this thread continues. Do you have another worry other than what has already been recommended?
 
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Old 10-29-17, 07:50 PM
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The reason this thread continues is because the sink may be cultured marble (that plastic type sink that looks like stone but in fact has a plastic coating). I know for a fact that the install instructions clearly state to not use plumber's putty (it will stain a permanent mark), but instead use silicon to install the drain and if needed use silicon to seal the faucet. If it's only going to be a few years then I guess it makes no difference what the OP uses.

Now to clarify, I have not seen this so called staining and I prefer the putty, BUT read the install info that comes with the sink or faucet assembly.
 
  #23  
Old 10-30-17, 04:48 PM
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Well....I read this a bit late and used the plastic pop up...

The hardest part of the job i think was putting the pop up lever on the pivot

I used putty...on the flange and plastic plate...and some thread sealant on the pop up threads.

i checked everything by filling the sink and draining ...then just running the faucets,,did not see any leaks until late last night
i ran the faucet,,
a bit of water was coming from the threads below the large lock nut

i tightened up the large lock nut -- a few cranks ..tried the water test again..so far no leaks..
if it leaks again, not sure how may turns i can make on the lock nut.
I don't want to over tighten it
 
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Old 10-30-17, 05:24 PM
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Only way to properly test a drain assembly is to fill the sink full with water and let it rush down the drain a few times.

Plumbers putty will not stain a drain pop up assembly as the putty is completely hidden underneath the assembly. Only stain you will see is if you remove the drain years from now, and reinstall another drain which will cover any discoloration again. Experience talks here. Discoloration is a factor on the faucet as not all faucets have the same profile and some discoloration could show if a round or oval body faucet is replacing an square body previous faucet. But, in my experience, no such staining has effected any of my installs.

Not to sound flippant, but at some point, the voice of experienced installers should prevail.
 
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Old 10-30-17, 07:41 PM
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Not to sound flippant, but at some point, the voice of experienced installers should prevail.
Not put too fine a point on it but you've made similar remarks like this in the past. Yes experience does speak for itself. And what makes you think most of us here have not had experience with things of this nature. You don't need to install a hundred sinks and faucets to be as experienced as the fellow who installed say a dozen or two.

A wise old man once told me, do not mix up experience with repetitive action. Ten years experience doing one repetitive job is only one years experience being done over and over for ten years.

PS...Concerning the staining problem. If I get the chance I will find the manufacturers lit that cautions about using plumbers putty on certain types of sinks and fixtures. But in the meantime you might want to look at this other forum.

I guess the experience from other plumbers may not count to some on this forum.

https://www.plbg.com/forum/read.php?1,219071

Be sure to read the last post on this link.
 
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Old 10-30-17, 11:02 PM
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Ok, that's enough guys. Don't make me come back there. I'll turn this car around right now. And all those other empty threats our parents made....

Per the Oatey putty instructions....

– What is the difference between Stain-Free and regular plumber’s putty?
 Stain-Free Putty is an oil-free non-staining putty that performs the same as other putties be can be used safely without staining the following materials; Granite, Marble, Quartz, Sandstone, Corian®, or any natural, porous surfaces.

Q – If the putty is dried out, something be added to regenerate the putty?
 No. Once the putty has dried there is nothing that can be added to regenerate the putty without affecting the quality of the product.

Q – How can an oil stain be removed from a porous surface (stone, granite, etc.)?
 Oatey does not have any proven method for removing these stains and recommend you contact your installer or supplier for their recommendations relating to the material in question.

So maybe it stains stuff, maybe it doesn't, but if the manufacturer specifically warns against it...that's the advice I'm sticking with.

Same with the faucet. Getting ready to put in a new one in kitchen. Instructions say no silicone, just gasket, unless surface is damaged or uneven. Then a small bead around the perimeter of gasket. Mines undamaged, so just the gasket.

If you want to deviate from basic industry standard specs, then please note as to why. "Because I always do it that way" doesn't really cut it. Now if you want to quote the manufacturer with a "but I've always done xxx and never had an issue" that's another matter. It gives the person a choice.

This house has all the receptacles and switches held into the boxes with sheetrock screws. Yeah, they work (I've even seen someone on here say they work fine) and I'm sure the installer never had a problem, but they are a royal PITA when it comes time to change the receptacle or switch and there's no thread for the correct screws to follow or the box is cracked because the screw went it at an angle. Somehow I'll bet I'll never see manufacturers instructions saying it's ok to use sheetrock screws even if they don't prohibit it. Apparently it's ok with inspectors though.
 
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Old 10-31-17, 09:51 AM
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Use plumbers putty. They make a putty for cultured marble. Silicone maks a mess and is not needed.. Also putty under faucet washer plate they give you..

For the pop up use teflon paste around washer and threads. It will never leak. I been doing this 35 years..
 
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Old 10-31-17, 09:52 AM
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Non staining putty...............



 
  #29  
Old 10-31-17, 09:53 AM
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OK, I'm turning the car around.
This post has some misleading facts and some good facts, just let me help clear it up a little because I've worked on counters for a long time and I "think" I know what I'm doing. I'll try to make it quick and prioritize:

- Do not roll out any type of putty on a granite top, use cardboard or whatever. The putty is petroleum based and will leave stains. You will be able to see the tracks and there is no way of cleaning I know of. I have had to replace tops because of this mistake.

- Silicone or putty under faucet plate: Putty is preferred, it fills the voids better.
You can see in the pic below the caulk failed and allowed water intrusion:

- Technically putty will degrade plastic due to chemical reaction and should not be used on plastic pop up bodies and especially should not be used on cultured marble tops. Putty on cultured tops will cause veins to appear around the drain hole. It might even crack and I know of now way to clean the veins, the top is shot.

- Pop ups will leak through the inside diameter of the large rubber mack washer. Experience has no part in stopping the leak by tightening.
Back down the nut, washer and friction ring and apply Teflon paste to the male threads. Move everything up and retighten.
The paste is pretty much a guarantee the mack washer will not leak. I don't get call backs.
The cheapest or most expensive body will leak past the mack washer, it should always be sealed from the inside diameter.
 
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Old 10-31-17, 02:10 PM
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  #31  
Old 11-05-17, 12:14 PM
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Well..I was out for a while.

i am sorry this turned into such a long thread with varying answers,
I appreciate all the help and tips as this was my first endeavor into this area,. ,,

,,so, here is an update.

As I mentioned, this sink and counter is 22+ yrs old and we are looking to remodel in 4-6 yrs.
i just wanted to get a working faucet and pop up, which i seem to have achieved.
Next is to replace the other faucet next to this one as it is a double sink counter.


in my last post, I said I tightened up the large lock nut a few 1/4 turns.
that seemed to have stopped any leaks from the pop up area as i filled the sink with hot and cold water and it let it drain slow and no leaks.

went a week with no leaks.

the wife was in the bathroom cleaning and had the water on yesterday.
I noticed small drip on paper i had down. To the back of the sink.
it may have been the hot water shut off valve or supply line.
I tightened down the supply line and turned the water on for 5 minutes and no drops visible.
I will keep an eye on it...

i am going to post a new question about the tub faucet in the bathroom which is also quite old.
not that the wife saw the new faucet, she wants the soaking tub faucet undated.

thanks
 
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