Issues when installing a toilet and replacing toilet flange on the floor

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Old 10-28-17, 08:11 PM
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Issues when installing a toilet and replacing toilet flange on the floor

There is a slight bent that goes up on the toilet flange as you can see in the pic if you look carefully. No cracks. Toilet flange is above the floor type.
Can a slight bent on toilet flange cause toilet leak? I lay down thin plastic sheets where the vinyl flooring has been removed from a previous leak, and then installed the toilet with wax ring, and then fluidmaster's universal rubber ring, and both times it leaked very slightly about 30 minutes after installing the toilet. Could a slight bit uneveness created by removal of previous vinyl flooring create enough gaps that caused the leaks both times with wax ring and rubber ring? So to prevent water leak from the toilet does the floor need to be perfectly even? If that's the case I suspect I should not use linoleum flooring when I re-do the flooring in this bathroom because linoleum will sag a bit to give that cushion feeling.

I think the toilet flange on the floor needs to be placed because of the bent. Is this something that can be done by an average person? My fear is when I remove the flange, the pipe underneath might fall.
 
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Old 10-29-17, 04:56 AM
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Generally if the flange is bent up where the toilet hold down bolts go then the cause is the tension from the bolts pulled the flange up over time. It likely was not the floor that did it.

Why in the world did you install a wax ring and a Fluidmaster Universal Toilet Seal? You use one or the other but not both.

If you want to use wax rings start with a jumbo wax ring and if that's not tall enough to seal set a plain wax ring on top. Then when you install the toilet they will squish together. If you want to use the Fluidmaster follow the installation instructions.
 
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Old 10-29-17, 05:40 AM
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No, I used the rubber ring on first attempt, and removed the rubber ring, then used wax ring on 2nd attempt. It was two separate install attempts. Both times, it had slight leaks I could see by pushing in a thin piece of newspaper as much as possible onto the side of toilet on the floor.

So the toilet flange needs to be replaced as the slight bent on the flange was likely cause for the leak? When I unbolt the flange, is it possible the pipe underneath the flange can fall?
 
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Old 10-29-17, 05:57 AM
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The pipe is supported from below and should not fall. If you want to remove the flange you can pick up an attachment for a drill that is designed to cut the inside of a pvc pipe, or you could chisel it out. Is the flange cracked on top? How about one more try with an Oatey Jumbo Wax ring....has 40% more wax and might just seal everything up. Don't know if you put the wax on the flange or bottom of toilet but try this......warm the flange with a hair dryer, put the wax ring on the warmed flange, put the toilet onto the wax ring. Did the wax ring you use have a plastic extension that fit into the center of the flange or did you get a wax ring without the extension?
While you're add it get new bolts....those are pretty rusty. Also, don't over tighten....that may be the reason why the flange was bent upward in the bolt area.
 

Last edited by JIMMIEM; 10-29-17 at 06:11 AM. Reason: Add info
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Old 10-29-17, 06:01 AM
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I don't see a slight off level toilet flange as being the cause of the leak. Make sure your wax seal is at room temperature when you install it. Use a thick ring to ensure good contact. When lowering the toilet onto the bolts have a second person help position it so you don't disturb the ring when you set the toilet down. The toilet should contact the ring and momentarily "float over the floor" and require you to use your body weight to squish the ring into place. If it doesn't "float" initially, then the ring is not making contact and therefore can never seal properly.
 
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Old 10-29-17, 06:09 AM
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I threw the wax ring's box away but it was for the flange even or below the floor type (my flange is above the floor), and on the receipt, it says Jumbo so I think it was a Jumbo wax ring, and it did have plastic extension that fit into the center hole of the flange. I placed it on the toilet instead of on the flange when attempting to install. There are no cracks on the flange. It has some wax stains. So it sounds like the bent on the floor was probably not the cause of the leak.....? And it sounds like removing the flange on the floor can be involved.....? The toilet is 14 years old. Is it possible there might be some very small cracks in the toilet that caused the leak? There were no water on the wood after I removed the toilet after noticing tips of newspaper got wet when I pushed it onto the side of toilet. Maybe what I'm describing is not a leak....?
 

Last edited by BeingCareful88; 10-29-17 at 06:41 AM.
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Old 10-29-17, 06:13 AM
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That looks like a PVC flange. You could file or sand the raised spot instead of replacing the flange.

I agree with using the thicker rings.
 
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Old 10-29-17, 06:25 AM
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Toilet should be pretty tight to the ground after installation. Being able to slide newspaper under it sounds like the toilet is floating on the flange and not seated on the floor. Any leaks would be the result of the toilet rocking slightly during use creating a bad seal. Use shims to steady the toilet if it contacts the flange before the floor to prevent any movement.

Lawrosa has a series on using plaster of paris under the toilet to prevent rocking or the need for shims. It was in the stickies in the plumbing section and may be worth a read in your situation.
 
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Old 10-29-17, 06:44 AM
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Well, the newspaper doesn't slide all the way in under the toilet. It will push in about 1/10" of an inch on the edge of the the bottom of toilet.
 
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Old 10-29-17, 06:57 AM
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If it's only 1/10" then it sounds like you've got good floor contact. As others have said if the toilet rocks then you should add some shims to stop it from rocking. When you set the toilet did you push it down and sit on it to compress the wax and get the edges to contact the floor? Also, remove all the old wax and crud and get everything clean before install the new wax ring. Also, make sure you lower the toilet straight down.....make sure the flange bolts are a 3 pm and 9 pm from the wall at the back of the toilet before you place the toilet onto the bolts.....this will ensure that the toilet will sit square to the wall.
 
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Old 10-29-17, 06:56 PM
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What can I use or buy to remove the old wax and crud from the flange? The wax is also on the bottom of the toilet which I think needs to be removed as much as possible.

I have not tried sitting on the toilet after I installed it. I just moved it with my both arms with the toilet bolted down and couldn't rock it, but I guess I need to sit on it to seal it to the max and see if it will rock while I sit on it?
 
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Old 10-30-17, 04:34 AM
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Use a plastic putty knife to scrap off the wax. A scrubber sponge dipped in warm water will work well too. Sitting on the toilet uses your body weight to seat and spread the wax. Install the bolts, install the wax ring, lower the toilet onto the bolts, push toilet down (sit on it), twist toilet slightly, install nuts onto bolts, tighten nuts (back and forth pattern), don't over tighten....just enough to prevent toilet from rocking .
 

Last edited by JIMMIEM; 10-30-17 at 04:41 AM. Reason: Add info
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