Layout lines for diagonal application

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Old 02-08-08, 08:06 PM
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Layout lines for diagonal application

I just did my first floor laying the tile on the diagonal. It came out allright, but I had no clue the best way to snap my lines to start. I ended up making only one guide line from the back wall to the doorway which split the center of the 12 inch tiles from top point to bottom point. After setting the one row of full tiles, I began working off those tiles to fill in the rest. I don't think my way was the most logical since I ended up with some real tough cuts along the walls/corners. The spacing was 1/16th since the tile was polished travertine. My joints got a little off as I worked through the field and I started not using the spacers and just "fudging" the tiles to make up for some joints that started getting off track. Any advice for next time would be appreciated.
Mark
 
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Old 02-08-08, 09:14 PM
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The spacers is what kicked your butt.

Think about this just for a moment. A diagonal tile layout is nothing more than a square grid that is skewed 45 degrees.

When you struck your centerline you were good to that point and could have used a few tiles layed down dry (as you did) to get you requirements for spacing the tiles.

Once you have that information you could then have layed out the floor with a chalk line and snapped down a chalk grid at 45 degrees to the center line using the spacing you determined.

Use a story-pole next time and you will eleminate a bunch of error. Make your marks on a long stick of some kind. Then, instead of using a tape to measure out each grid use the marks from the story pole/stick. There is less error that way.
 
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Old 02-13-08, 10:20 AM
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Hey Bud, With the story stick, when I mark my lines for a 12 x 12 tile and a 1/16th space, do I just make a line at every 12 1/16th inch interval to make it work out perfectly???? And how did the spacers screw me up? I thought spacers would be a guarantee of consistency? Still trying to figure the best way out!
 
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Old 02-13-08, 11:54 AM
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Hey Bud, With the story stick, when I mark my lines for a 12 x 12 tile and a 1/16th space, do I just make a line at every 12 1/16th inch interval...
I do it with two grids in mind. In that case you would theoretically have a grout dimension, a tile dimension, a grout dimension, and another tile dimension. So to answer your question YES.

I think you are asking for trouble trying to hold your grout joints to only 1/16".

to make it work out perfectly????
YOW RIGHT!!!

And how did the spacers screw me up? I thought spacers would be a guarantee of consistency?
Spacers are a guarantee of inconsistency. Not all of your tiles will be exactly the same size. That's just the way they are. You may hold a ruler up to each tile and convince yourself (through your lying eyes) that all the tiles are the same, but they aren't. Now, stab a spacer between each tile as you go and as you can see, things go to hell pretty quick. The spacers are perfect in size, the tiles are not.

If you free hand the tiles to a layout line you'll have some error but it all comes out in the wash.

Still trying to figure the best way out!
I've been tryin' to figure "the best way out" for thirty years.
 
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Old 02-13-08, 03:14 PM
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Mr. Cline, you are a natural born comic!

I'm not a professional, but we've been remodeling our home for so long that we're back to the beginning and are remodeling the remodeling!

Lernin', while Mr. Cline is correct that there are slight differences in the tile sizes, I think for the first time or two that you lay tile, spacers are a great idea. They work well if you remember to butt the tiles- all the tiles- every time-to the spacer. The same thing goes for depth...if the spacer is sticking up above the tile, then that tile is too low or you haven't pushed the spacer all the way in. The spacer has to be flush with the tile-all the tiles-all the time.

Also, don't try to pluck the spacers out to reuse them. Buy enough to do the whole job. Be sure you seat the tile in the thinset, firmly, don't be afraid to take up a tile and re-spread/
remove or add thinset if needed.

Try the disc shaped spacers, like Tavy http://www.tools4flooring.com/tile-spacers-c-60_66.html
They're a lot easier to use than those little white x's.
Connie
 
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Old 02-14-08, 04:23 PM
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Thanks for all the info Bud and Connie!

Bud, I agree with you about the 1/16th space being hard to keep consistent....especially with travertine which is more often imperfect than most ceramics I have used.

Connie, about the Tavy spacers...do you lay them flat on top of the tile???? I'm used to using the traditional type in the tombstone method (standing on end). They look interesting for sure!
 
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Old 02-14-08, 07:11 PM
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The Tavy spacers, (there are other brands- I got mine at Lowe's a couple of years ago.) have a cross shape on one side. The top of the disc has a ridge that you hold like a handle. The cross will be in the size you prefer- they come in numerous sizes, like one sixteenth, one eighth, etc. So, you set the spacer between the tile just like the "x" spacers, but now, you can see if a tile is high or low, you get the joint width you want and when you butt the tiles to the spacers, they don't fall over. Voila! Your floor will look great!
 
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Old 02-14-08, 09:09 PM
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But if the tiles are "pillowed" the Tavy spacers would be difficult to use if not useless.

Next you'll want us to think that stupid "Puck" really works also. I guess if you want to level your camper it's OK.
 
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Old 02-15-08, 06:10 AM
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Bud - still a Tavy fan I see

Hey don't forget the thin skin - I think thats what he calls it.
 
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Old 02-15-08, 06:46 AM
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Yessirree!!! Armand and I are great friends - I have several circus performers as friends. Have you ever noticed with all the tile forums and home repair forums and construction forums, and how-to forums there are the only place you see that Thin-Skin mentioned is in his advertising.
 
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Old 02-16-08, 09:22 AM
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Talking

You guys are a hoot! I promise not to recommend the puck, and for the benefit of our poster, Mark, I think "Armand" is a guy making a bucketful of money selling "helpful" products to novices.

BUT, I stand by my comment that the Tavy spacers work well for folks without a lot of tile floor experience. (Except for "pillowed" tiles, but no one would use those on a floor, now, would they?)

Connie
 
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Old 02-16-08, 09:53 AM
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(Except for "pillowed" tiles, but no one would use those on a floor, now, would they?)
Of course they would, they are plentiful and being used everyday, it is the floor tile I was referring to.

You guys are a hoot!
I think "Armand" is a guy making a bucketful of money selling "helpful" products to novices.
Tavy is the "HOOT". Ya just gotta know the guy. He might be making money I have no idea, he must be paying his advertising bills. The guy is pure genius! This summer I heard he was going to be shot from a cannon somewhere.
 
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