foamy orange water after regeneration


  #1  
Old 11-24-07, 08:20 AM
S
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 4
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
foamy orange water after regeneration

I have a 460i ge water conditioner 8 months old. For about 2 months the softness has been deteriorating and lately, after regeneration, water runs foamy for a few seconds, then orange for a minute or so. My plumber had me put rust out directly in the tube in the back of the brine tank (sorry, I don't know what some of these parts are called). The softness has improved but the foamy, orange problem after regeneration persists. Any ideas?
 
  #2  
Old 11-24-07, 10:31 AM
A
Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Northwest Ohio
Posts: 1,478
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
I am assuming you are on well water, right?

What are your source water test results?

GE softeners are not top of the line and often have problems handling water far below what is printed on the box. Since you are under warranty, you should call the store you bought it from and ask what actions they can take on your behalf.

Because your softener backwashes with hard, iron-laddened water, it may be that the initial water use is carrying spewing out the remnants of the backwash.

Let us know more about the exact unit you have and your water quality at the source.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II
 
  #3  
Old 11-24-07, 05:20 PM
S
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 4
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
brand and numbers

Andy

Thanks for the reply. The brand is Luxuary Water. My hardness number was 40 and iron was 5 parts per something. Everyone commented that the iron content was high and the water very hard (yes, it is well water with no odor. Except for the iron and hardness it was good water).

Why would the backwash spew into the service line?

The softener worked fine with none of these symptoms for a few months. Thanks again!
 
  #4  
Old 11-26-07, 01:35 PM
A
Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Northwest Ohio
Posts: 1,478
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Man, 40 grain PLUS 5 parts iron! If I multiply iron by 4 that makes 20. Add 40 parts of hardness and you have 60 gpg compensated hardness. That is more than your model can handle for more than a short while under noraml use.

What I meant is that when your system backwashes, it uses extremely hard water with very high iron during this process. Chances are part of this "backwas" remains after the regeneration (builds up on the resin surfaces) and it shows up at your faucets.

It took some time for this to happen as it built up in the resins. Now you are seeing the result. Are you using an iron out salt? You may be able to get a few more months of use out if it, but I would say its days are numbered.

Consider a quality softener on your next purchase.

Wish I could be of more help,

Andy Christensen, CWS-II
 
  #5  
Old 11-26-07, 03:28 PM
S
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 4
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Andy-Yes, the number 60 is a number that was mentioned to me by everyone selling me a softener (this is a new house and I looked into several options before deciding, wrongly it appears, on the Luxuary Water offered through my local plumber). I am now using "Res Care" added by a drip method to that tube in the back of the brine tank. I will get an iron out salt, too.

The distributor told my plumber that this softener could handle this level of hardness. I'll explore a warranty claim. Finally, do you have a suggestion for the kind of softener that can handle this level of hardness. I "interviewed" Kinetico and Culligan among others. I'm willing to spend the money necessary to solve the problem.

You have been very helpful. Thank you!

Bill
 
  #6  
Old 11-27-07, 07:38 AM
A
Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Northwest Ohio
Posts: 1,478
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
There are a plethora of water treatment options out there; some work and some don't. Most people make the mistake to go the cheap way around first but find out that going cheap can be very costly.

Given the choice between Kinetico and Culligan, I feel the Kinetico is far and away a better choice. It is more expensive to buy buy cost less in the long run.

With a single tank (resin tank) clalculating softener opertaions is different from a twin tank set up. You will need to 'estimate' how much water you will be using on a daily basis along with water quality. This can be a guessing game and most often works out OK.

With a twin tank, the number of people using the water (number of gallons per day) is not normally a factor in calculating for regeneration procedures.

At 60 grain per gallon with a twin tank you would need 10x54" tanks or the MACH 2100s model. You have very challenging water and getting a softener too small will not accomplish the tasks you desire.

Let us know how you are coming along.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II
 
  #7  
Old 11-27-07, 09:24 PM
S
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: michigan
Posts: 43
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Iron filters...THE WAY OF THE FUTURE!!!

The simple answer is to say your water softener isnt rinsing long enough. But sorry to tell you but with your water test your going to need more than a water softener. I would definitely recommend putting a iron filter before your softener.
 
  #8  
Old 11-28-07, 07:49 AM
A
Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Northwest Ohio
Posts: 1,478
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
As I mentioned, the present equipment will not work with that much iron, but a properly sized softener, especially a twin, will work fine.

http://www.watertechonline.com/artic...ndexID=6636754

An iron filter prior to the softener you have now will greatly help but your unit may already be due for the graveyard. But which kind of iron filter is adequate; there are many types and some work better than others.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II

ps. Not sure if this link is allowed for this forum, my apologies if not.
 
  #9  
Old 12-01-07, 07:35 AM
S
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 4
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
its dead

Andy- I think the softener has died. The service water now runs the color of urine even after the initial foamy, orange water that follows regeneration. Is there anything that can be done to give me a few more days of usable water for dishes etc. (we have an RO but I am reluctant to put this water through it. We are drinking bottles water)?

In evaluating the problem I remembered that my local plumber set the hardness setting at 40 gpg (my softener allowed for a setting between 0 and 99). My water test from the University of Iowa hygienic lab showed 610 mg/L as CaCO3 and 5.2 mg/L of total iron. Could you tell me what those numbers translate into for total compensated hardness and is it that number at which the softener should be set. Thanks again. You have been a very helpful resource.

Bill
 
  #10  
Old 12-02-07, 06:29 AM
A
Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Northwest Ohio
Posts: 1,478
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Compensated hardness (CH) is a calculation that allows the softener to compensate for iron and mananese. Manganese is normally quite low and therefore not often isolated for factoring.

Iron, however, is a major factor. One company I worked for wanted to factor by 3, the present one does it by 4. I agree with four as it is better to elbow high than low.

Divide hardness mg/l (ppm) by 17.1 to get grains per gallon, then add (mulitple 5.2 iron by 4) and you get your (total) TCH.

36 gpg + 20.8 = about 57 CH. That is very challenging water but none too difficult for a quality softener to handle.


How may people are using water and does that number vary at times? If you are looking for a replacement, consider a twin tank approach.

Andy Christesnen, CWS-II
 
  #11  
Old 01-10-08, 10:57 AM
J
Banned. Rule And/Or Policy Violation
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 0
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
your softner is probley not going to work on that much iron, especially since you have 40grain hardness. You might need to look into somthing like TERMINATOR for the iron removal.

http://www.apswater.com/article.asp?..._smells_and_pH)
 
  #12  
Old 01-10-08, 02:12 PM
A
Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Northwest Ohio
Posts: 1,478
Upvotes: 0
Received 0 Upvotes on 0 Posts
Jasonandjason24,

We are not to use this forum to promote specific product lines. I notice in this thread and others you are referring to a particular website with specific products.

Moderators look down on this. Please try to modify your contributions with your points, experience and opinions rather than just linking to your (favorite) web site.

Andy Christensen, CWS-II
 
 

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
 
Ask a Question
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: