6013 rod question?

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  #1  
Old 02-12-03, 12:56 AM
insainity
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6013 rod question?

Hey guys i have a question i have welded with 7018s for years but recently bought a 220v 1968 Sears and Robuck arc welder for use at home.LOL yea its older than me sence i was born in 72.But i only gave 50 bucks for it out of a yard sell.It runs pretty good.
Anyway the guy gave me a bunch of wet rods with it. but anyway there where some 6013s mixed in there that were a little dry.I was impressed with them.They arc on just about anything like a 6011 but lay a bead like a 7018.Sence i had never used them before i went and bought a pound to try some welds with.Im very impressed.I dont have a building so i have to leave trailers and stuff im working on outside so i have to prime it.They will arc right though the paint,makeing them much handier for me.

But anyway my question is how strong is a weld laid by this rod 6013 verses the 7018?
I recently broke some tacks that i didnt want to break.And i dont think they would have broke if they had been laid by a 7018.There for leading me to believe that they may not be as strong as the 7018.Any comments would be greatly apreciated.Before i have stuff breaking on me!
 
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Old 02-12-03, 07:42 AM
S
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I used 6013 in the early years and it does have its place. It has a nice finish. It is a whip and pause rod like 6011 but is a little looser and is considered a fill freeze rod where 11 is fast freeze. It doesnt have the elasticity that 7018 has though and less shock resistance. 6011 has fair modulous of elasticity too, (the amount it will stretch and return before failure. But you want to remember, thats at the point of ultimate failure. Tacks are small so you reach that easily where a full weld would be so strong it would never come to that point. Remeber on steel rods the 60 and the 70 are their respective tensile strength which is above the steel you are usually working on. Now having said all that companies are making 7018 for AC use also. Hobart makes it and has it at Tractor Supply and Lincoln makes it,,I think it is LH73. It works really well and has way better restrike that the regular DC stuff. The only thing is it is a little looser on verts and you have to weave a little instead of stringer.
 
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Old 02-13-03, 01:28 AM
insainity
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Smile

Thank you thats exactlly what i wanted.
I was trained to arc weld (for a maitenance postion) by two different people at a saw mill i worked for.Both tought me alot.But nethier could tell me tecnical stuff like that.And my local welding supplyer wasnt much help either.Short sweet answers.

So how did you get so smart anyway? Are there any books or web sites that discuse this in this typ of detail.I didnt even no what the 60 or 70 stood for (tensile strength)Thank you.
Im was recently trained by Trinity Marine for flux core.And im wanting to buy a mig so any technical info on any typ of welding would be great.
 
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Old 02-13-03, 12:02 PM
Portable Welder
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Boy oh boy that sberry sure does sound like a smart guy, I'm much more of a hands on, kinda guy, I've never used 6013 rod but I'm ready to give some a try. I'm good at giving basic hand on imformation and I'll ask sberry all the technical stuff.
As for advise on a mig welder go with a brand name and you wont regret it Miller, Lincoln, or Hobart. Go to your welding supply store and find out what brand he carries, I preffer Miller but lincoln is every bit as good, If you go with any other brand you might save yourself a couple hundred dollars and when you go to use it you'll see why it was cheaper. When you find out what brand you want to buy leave us a message and let us know how thick the steel your going to weld and we will give you some good advise and not have you buy more machine than you need.
Good luck.
 
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Old 02-14-03, 01:26 PM
S
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Thanks for the good copy. Like Portable I am pretty much hands on guy also. I happen to be listening one day in class somewhere and I remember that they can engineer different properties in steel welding rods is all. All that is one reason I push for 7018 AC for DIY welders. It is easiest and most forgiving and even a lot of ugly welds are strong. It just seems to work about the best if you factor in fatigue strength, shock, stretch and variety of steels, also operator skill factor. Lincoln has a page that lists their rods and I have read thru them. When it comes to alloys I am lost just like most people and have to ask someone like Steve from US Alloys that posts answers here once in a while.
 
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Old 02-14-03, 03:43 PM
scrapiron
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Lincoln Electric has a book available titled "The Procedure Handbook of Arc Welding" which contains lots of interesting stuff. It contains information on consumables, welding processes and metallurgy and has a bunch of helpful tables and charts. I imagine it can be found on their web site. They also publish a neat quarterly paper that shares welding projects and ideas called the "Stabilizer" but it dosent seem like I've gotten this for a while. There's a magazine called "Practical Welding" by the FMA that's interesting though alot of the information dosen't apply to the average job shop. Reading this stuff is a great way to pick up a little extra knowledge. Does anyone know of any other welding/ fabricating/maintenance type magazines for the small shop guy?
 
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Old 03-25-03, 08:31 PM
NutAndBoltKing
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Welding Through Painted Surfaces

A good fitting clean joint is often hard to find. We'd still be using bare uncoated electrodes if every joint was a good clean fit.

The purposes behind the coatings on electrodes include; stablizing the arc which allows better penetration and reduces spatter, produces slag over the finished weld to protect it from atmospheric contamination and forces a slower cooling, acts as a cleanser and deoxidizaing agent in the molten crater, and produces gases - carbon dioxide mainly, to protect the molten metals from atmospheric oxides and nitrades that will weaken the weld.

As such, the coating of a 6013 electrode, titania potassium, will help allow penetration through, deoxidizing and cleansing away of paint (even oil and grease) in welded joints. The cellulose potassium coating on a 6011 helps that same process.

Good welds start off with good clean well fitted joints. No doubt weld quality improves as the condition and preparation of the joint improves, but welding through paint is very often unavoidable, and it becomes a very do-able process due to the coating(s) on the electrode, and of course the ability and skills of the welder. It's ultimatley the mechanic, not the tool; but those electode coatings help permit welding through painted surfaces.
 
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Old 03-26-03, 09:45 PM
S
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Not every weld has to be nuclear quality either. Sometimes its just to seal out moisture, or dust, or just doesnt have to be structurally perfect either. Brackets and lots of other joints just never aproach ultimate strength of any of these rods and dont need to and if they were perfect someone would be wasting way to much time and effort. There are millions of pounds of steel attatched with 6013 in the world that work just fine. It isnt the first choice for demanding conditions where hi shock and ductility are required. But for general use with buzz boxes it works well and has a nice finish. I can think of lots of welding done in less than ideal conditions, dirty and such where it just doesnt matter.
 
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