House was built in 1972, We bought it in 1996. Never had a problem with system. Till Now
Conventional System, Tank and leech field.
~1000 gal tank, concrete, with a single "Manhole" above input port.
Input & output ports typical for this age like 4" or so diameter openings with a similar sized area of a concrete baffle in front of each. No filters or screens.
About 75 feet away from the tank is a single vent pipe.

In 2007 the county came out to check the system. Apparently there were many systems installed without any permits around the time this house was made. And many were installed with metal tanks, and these tanks are rusting out and actually collapsing. People have fell into them. So they are inspecting every system.

Mine was fine tank wise. being a standard concrete tank.

But they said the leech field is failing. And a whole new system or even possibly a mound system may need to be installed soon. They said this after digging some holes in the leech field area. you can tell where it is going because there is this large comma shaped area coming away from the vent pipe. Where the grass is greener and grows faster. They dug and found gray soil instead of the typical tan in this area.

They stomped all around the area and said at least it's still dry, which this gray soil was. and the yard where it's super green is also was dry.

That was in 2007, and it has stayed dry till now. Now you can see surface water, and it's not nice water it smells like septic tank water so the field is now for sure not draining well at all.

I first saw that airation thing and seemed wonderful, then read about the horror stories of what happened to people with single tanks like I have here.

Then read about the like generic like oxyclean stuff. sounds interesting and after that then run some other stuff.

So anyway.

looking for suggestions here how to try to salvage this system.

I'm Old and disabled, only income is disability. so putting a whole new system in is not an option.

Thanks for your assistance.

 

Welcome to the forums!

Do you know how many feet of drain field you have? Can you tell if all the drain field is working?

Back when I was young I had a mound type septic system that wasn't installed properly When it got plugged up I dug it up and unclogged it and added 40' of drain line. I did all the work by hand so my only cost was the pipe and gravel ..... but that was 30+ yrs ago It might be possible to repair/tweak what you have.

Some of the others will probably have better suggestions so stay tuned

 

Honestly, I have no idea how the drain field is laid out in any way. And the county doesn't either. It was one of the systems installed without any permits at all.

In the photo the house is the brown at the bottom,
The Light Green dot is the tank
The yellow dot is the vent pipe, it is surrounded by a circle of Day Lilliys.
The red dot is where the black ooze is starting to appear.

Now What was the two stage ummm chemical thing to try? Like first was the Sodium Percarbonate.

How much of this stuff is needed? And how is it introduced into the field?

Same Questions about the second chemivcal, what was it I read should use after the Sodium Percarbonate? How much and how to get it where it is needed?

I know the Bubble thing on a single tank like this has had some disastrous results. But from what I have read it seems, like maybe this ws more caused by a mechanical effect of a too vigorous bubbling effect. And it really mixes up the tank both the sludge and scum layers get mixed into everything as if a giant agitator was used on the tank.

What about a less strong bubbling action? One that still adds Oxygen to the ummmm "Fluid" but not so much in power that is causes a strong mixing action. But how about some super fine bubbles like from a fish tank aerator?

How much "AIR" is actually needed to oxygenate the "Fluid"? If it is ran 24/7 ya know?

 

Best to have the main tank pumped. Then try to find out if you have laterals or one long lateral.

Possible where that vent pip is may be a seepage pit??

Before you do anything you would need to find out. Possible with a camera inspection?

If laterals/lateral you need to uncover the end of the pipe and have the line cleared with a jetting machine. Then treat with aid ox... Or find the D box...

 

Best to have the main tank pumped.
We have Pumped it every year. And did a week or so ago.


Then try to find out if you have laterals or one long lateral.
How would one go and learn this?

Possible where that vent pip is may be a seepage pit??
Also, How would one learn if it is or not?

Before you do anything you would need to find out. Possible with a camera inspection?
First that sounds costly, (remember I'm old and on disability as only income) Plus can't trust any special people like that to do it, for pretty sure they would inform the county of the current problem. Don't need to raise any red flags if at all possible.


If laterals/lateral
In that picture what would you think is a lateral? Between the tank and the vent pipe there is zero seepage, and it is wide open and clear. Last time tank was pumped I ran water into that vent pipe, and in less than a minute later the water was heard flowing into the tank.

you need to uncover the end of the pipe and have the line cleared with a jetting machine.
You would think that that green grass is a "Lateral"? maybe? Just one? And it must be open, or how would the ooze be appearing at the far end?

Then treat with aid ox... Or find the D box...
I wonder even if there is a "D" Box?

 

If you have one continuous drain line, there is no D box. A distribution box is only used when you have several separate drain lines. The septic water goes to the D box and then gets routed to the different lines. Generally the type of ground and available room determine which type of drain field is installed.

Did the septic pumper have an observation about the condition of the fill lines? Generally if the tank is mostly fluid that means the lines aren't adequate.

 

Fill Line? What do you mean by "Fill Line'/

 

The pipe that makes up the drain field.

 

Nope, The company I use for pumping, is the same company I used when i had a farm and a pit under the barn. He's used to sucking out some nasty nasty stuff. and doesn't really care at all about any of it. We just pop off the lid and he sucks it out and we BS while he's doing it.

 

The few times I've had a tank pumped the guy always commented on the condition of the drain field. A lot of liquid with few solids means the drain field isn't operating correctly. Is there any particular reason you have it pumped every year?

 

It's just what the previous owners did since 1972. The dates are written on the basement wall he he he

 

OK airating a single tank seems to be a no-no. How about this...?

My tank empties into a say 75 foot long pipe at the end is a vent stand pip[e. and then it must make a 90 deg turn because thats where the grass is green and the black ooze is appearing.

How about doing the oxy for the mat, then the seep for the deadpan, adding both of these at this vent pipe so it is concentrated going out into the field.

Once this has been done then how about insert at this end at this vent pipe the air bubbler and just bubble down here and leave the main tank alone?

Thoughts?

 

I think the general conscientious is to pump the tank every 3-5 yrs.
My 24 yr old tank hasn't ever been pumped Still trying to find someone willing to drive a pumper truck up here, they are all intimidated by my driveway

 

If you pour water in the vent pipe and it goes back to the tank then thats wrong. That means the line from the vent to the red dot is full of water and its going back to the tank..

When you had the tank pumped did you rear water coming back into the tank when he was pumping it out?

The flow from your pic seems grn dot to yellow to red...

Shine a flashlight down the vent pipe. If thats a tank, such as seepage pit you may be able to aerate there and treat.

But I dont know what or why that vent pipe is there. I would say its not a vent at all. A service port? Clean out?

I dont know... You need to help us help you..We need to know whats there..

Any handymen in the area could help you? Call the local church as there are many good people will assist you I am sure...

We can guide you just need more info.

Take a pic of the vent pipe and surronding areas of concern. Plus the main tank...

 

Note...

I moved your post # 12 here from one of my posts you replied too...

ImO forget the septic seep... Nothing but peroxide and aeration if you can do it,,,,,

 

OK, I'm going to get some of the Sodium Percarbonate.

And the way the system seems to be laid out, it seems the most logical injection site would be at that vent pipe.

Now I have read to do like 4 doses once each day for 4 days is this correct?

And in what seems like a really small system like this, How much powder would be a dose?

I'll probably get it from here,
Sodium Percarbonate FB

 

When you pump the septic tank and find that there is very little solid material, the most common reason is that you did not need to pump the tank that soon. Typically you do the second pumping a little sooner than you would think (say after 2 years) and then each time thereafter make an educated guess as to when the next pumping will be needed.

Each time the septic tank is pumped, it should be inspected for broken or missing baffles or other parts and appropriate repairs made. Otherwise more grease (scum) will make its way to the leach field causing problems there.

If no one has been using water for several hours, the septic tank should be about 85% full (unless it was just pumped). If the septic tank stays nearly 100% full for long periods of time then you have reason to suspect a problem with the leach field.

Aerating a single chamber tank results in churned up sludge exiting and going to the leach field. With a dual chamber tank, the second chamber will catch that sludge.

 

Failed System Up Date,
Ok please look back at post #3 for a reminder of this system..
The yellow dot vent pipe, is just a "TEE", no tank or anything right there.
One side goes towards the tank, the other goes to the leech field. And the third of course goes up vertically above ground. It looks like this,

Starting August 1st, I monitored the levels at both the tank and at this vent pipe.
The measurement at the vent is made simply with a dip stick where it is inserted into the pipe and it goes in till it touch the bottom and then pulled out and the wet line is measured. Simple.

The tank I did not have a stick long enough, so I used the same dip stick, but measured the distance to the fluid level from the top of the riser lid as seen here,

Now below is a graph I made to keep track of these levels.
On August 12th we had a pretty good rain and it bumped up the vent pipe level some, Here is the chart.

Now on the 23rd & 24th we had a LOT of rain and it really pushed the levels up some. There was a considerable amount of black ooze on those days surfacing at the red dot area.

On the 25th AM the system was pumped out and of course all levels dropped as seen in the graph.

the tank of course because of the short dip stick stayed at zero for a while, and this tank must be really small because even tho this place has only two people here it seemed to rise pretty quickly.

The vent continued to drop as time went on.

on the 28th, the level in the vent pipe started to rise again.

This is when I started to add the powder AND the air.

Now don't laugh, since this is such a small area, the diameter of the pipes, it isn't a lot of fluid in one spot. So the aeration is made using a fish tank bubbler and a pair of air stones. the pump is rated for a 60 gallon fish tank and the two air stones make millions of super fine tiny bubbles.

The air is running 24/7.

The powder I divided up into many doses,
for the first 4 days 28th through 31st I put into the vent pipe 4 pounds in the morning and 4 pounds at night.

Then on Sept 1st I went to 4 pounds once a day, and today the 5th was the last day I will be adding any at all.

It was kinda scary when the levels kept rising, and on the 30th it diddn't seem like it did much.

the levels were about 2 inches less than the average. So thought, wow that was a wasted 100 bucks.

Then levels started dropping.

The tank dropped down to 21.5 inches on the dip stick and has been there ever since never changing so I'm pretty positive as in that drawing this is the bottom level of the exit pipe.

The vent pipe continued to fall.

On the 3rd night we had a very strong rainfall, and i see it bumped the field up some, but it recovered and is still falling again. How low will it go? hard to say, back down to the 5" maybe will have to wait and see,

also have to wait and see now that it's the bubbles only from now on, how it will progress.

What is nice is the yard has dried up totally.!! how cool is that?!

I'm thinking of getting the same size bubbler, and put it in the main tank to start to oxygenate it. Since the air isn't a giant amount like in the real commercial videos I have seen, and the bubbles are extremely small. I do not see haning the mixing churning problem. and it may slowly change the whole system over to an oxygen type of system. yes?

Wish me luck!

 

No, no, no!!! You will just churn up solids and clogg the feild more..

That Tee in the first pic should have no water in it.. Is that what you are aerating?

The tank in the second pit... Is that what yours has an outlet tee like shown? If so you need to get a filter in there...

I have the yellow one..

Gravity Filters

What did it cost to pump the main tank? It should have took a few weeks to fill. You need to conserve water and get low flow shower heads and such.. Take very very short showers...

If you can find the end of the lateral at the red dot, it may be best to jet the line from the yellow dot and suck up the biomat at the red dot..

Then treat again..

Have the tank pumped again.. Many times its way cheaper if its just water. Make a deal with the guy to swing by every few weeks to take some water out of the tank...

 

Yes the "TEE" is where I am aerating.
The "Stuff" comes out of the house,
It goes into the concrete round tank. Single tank one manhole. No separators, just one open space.
Like this.

A baffle going in and one going out just like in that drawing,
Then on the output is more pipe that heads out towards that "TEE"
Then we have the "TEE" and it IS a Tee. I with a feeler probed it and imagine like a 4" tee and thats what it is, One input side and one output side.

The output then only travels a few feet 2 or 3 and then you notice the fertile Green grass,

The red dot is only maybe 20 feet further away from the vent. and thats it.

Joe

 

Get a filter in that out baffle as I linked to. This will prevent solids from getting in the field..

Short of that if you are not going to jet the lateral then drain the tank again and treat some more...

Does that powder you bought make the water bubble up when you apply it ?

 

Yes on the bubbleing up, and no way to install the filter unless you actually go in and enter the tank on the input end. and walk over to the output end to install it.

 

Did you actually uncover the tank to see if there is an access cover there? Often there is a knock out and a pipe can be installed in the top of the tee...

 

Technically there is no actual "TEE" at the inputs or outputs. the hole in the wall where things pass through, then a curved concrete wall that is about ohh a foot tall or so that forms the baffle.

And as far as Un covering the end of the tank that would be incredible to try to do, for I have no idea as to where to start to dig, And if I did it would be extremely hard to do, because the tank is surrounded by 50 year old trees. It is amazing I do not have any root problems of any kind.

 

Is it a 1000 gallon concrete tank ?

It's true, there isn't a standard design; but most are 96" long and about 48" wide; and you have plenty of clues.

You already know how deep the top of the tank is (by looking below the cover that's used to access it for pumping). It's probably 12" to 24" below grade.

That access port is usually located at the mid point on the tank; and if it's square or a rectangle, you can almost pinpoint the location of the ports for the inlet and the outlet. Maybe a neighborhood kid could be hired to dig out the outlet port . . . . it's either that or plan on hiring a backhoe or an excavator to do the job.

I'd swing for the cheaper alternative first. It's been postponed too long.

 

The manhole right now is directly at the side wall, where the input is. that Baffle you can see right there in the opening. The other now is a question for sure.

 

Can you take pics of this inlet???

Sure dig to the outlet and you should see the same...


Hey listen... We dont want no one dead.. So dont fall in... have a ladder.... and always work in a team around a septic... Two guys at least...


Have an escape plan if something happens...

911....etc...

 

I'll take a pic tomorrow.

 

I was confused by the drawings submitted by the OP showing the riser in the middle of his tank. If his riser is at the inlet end ( and I gather this is where he's had the tank pumped from every year), then his outlet port is most likely located approximately 8' (96") downstream from the exposed inlet port, and the middle access port (as shown in the drawings) isn't exposed or used at all in his system, and he has to skip right over it to the other end of the tank to locate the outlet port and consider installing a filter.

I've been told that many septic pumpers actually prefer using the smaller (and much lighter) covers on either the inlet or the outlet ports, instead of the middle panel which is directly above the middle chamber in which the bulk of the sludge will have accumulated. I can't see how they can properly maneuver the suction hose to clean the middle chamber; but I gather that they can make up for that by just coming out to pump it out more frequently, especially if the homeowner is willing to facilitate that activity.

 

Yes that was just a grabbed off the net picture. It was the only one I could find where the tank is a single large chamber. And yes think the riser and manhole cover is yes directly on the edge of the tank directly over the inlet port.

Then by the time I get to the outlet port it's gonna be a BIG Dig, i'm guessing about 3 feet below the surface of the ground to the top of the tank. The existing riser is a tube of ohhh 2 feet. and it's top is already close to a foot below the ground surface.

Pics to follow later today.

Joe

 

Ok here are the pictures,
Here is the "Vent" and the area towards the leech field where I have to mow every two days or so because the grass grows so fast from the ummm fertile growing medium?

Ok here is the location of the septic tank. you can see how the lid itself is easily a foot or so below ground level.

Now this is lookinmg into the tank and showing the baffle it isn't PVC it is a more or less wall of concrete in front of the input.

Now the airation I put into the vent stack (first Picture) you can actually see the box that the pump is in, and the hoses going into the pipe.

At the bottom is a pair of fish tank airstones. they make millions of tiny bubbles like as seen in this you tube video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLea9GEJlGY
it is NOT a super viiolent air adgitation like i have seen in many of the air septic videos like this,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCcI40YG4Hk

It is a much gentler for sure.

So there ya all go. what I have done and what it has done. the level in the tanbl is still at the 21.5 level as always now. no doubt the level of the out put hole, and the level in the vent pipe has dropped another 1/2 inch.

 

The Tank is staying constant, so I bet the outlet I'm 99% sure is at that level on the tank wall.

The Level in the vent pipe continues to drop. How low it will go I do not know. Even when the tank was empty the vent never got below 5 inches. Soooo?

Now a question,,,, I'm assuming I'm now playing with a dual system.....

In the tank it is still an anaerobic system where the "Stuff" eating bacteria is the kind that does NOT use Oxygen in it's process.

BUT...........

I'm assuming now after adding the powder oxygenator, and the 24/7 bubbler, Am I to assume that the leech field is either changing over, or has changed over to an oxygen loving type of Bacteria?

Or possibly Both?

Now I have monthly added a dose of Rid-X to the tank, Now I'm assuming the bacteria it is giving are the non oxygen ones.

So I will again add another of these to the tank.

But if I want to help out the leech field, does Rid-X also have the oxygen type in it? or what product does? If I were to slowly add some where I have the bubbler running?

Joe

 

That stuff does break down the stuff in the septic. But the problem is is makes the tank a big soup or small particals that get out to the field..

The tank is supposed to seperate the solids to the bottom and scum layer on top.. Clear effluent is supposed to go out to the field..

How does rain not fill that septic tank up?

Thats the intake baffle?

 

Amazingly the rain does not flow into there. Probably because it's on a hillside for one, and directly up hill side above the tank access area is even a higher area do it diverts the rain water around the tank opening area.

And yes that is the input baffle.

soooo, hmmm, isn't that interesting? about the Rid-X? If it does as you say,, it should be the worst thing someone could do if they want their system to keep running at it's best.

Huh?

How about the idea of adding some of something at the bubbler site?

 

As long as there is water in that bubbler site, the peroxide powder is the bast thing you can add... But as you add and the system gets working better there will be no water in that tee..

Then just treat accordingly..

The problem with your bubbler in the tee is there is not a lot of water volume for aerobic action to take place.

 

So, what do you think is happening at the leech field / "TEE"?

AnAerobic, Aerobic, Both?

is there an aerobic bacteria available I can add?

etc.

Joe

 

Do you think there's any movement (flow) of effluent to the Leach Field ?

 

ABSOLUTELY!

After pumping the tank empty,, If we filled the tank in say 3 days, yeah hard to believe too, will have to try to see where all the water usage is coming from.

So anyway everything after the third day has to have gone to the field, it isn't showing up anywhere else. And the field is absolutely bone dry now compared to black oooze surfacing.

 

Running toilets #1 cause.....

Or water from the feild returning to the tank after being pumped.. The pumper should of stated this...

 

Nope checked toilets, both turn off at maybe only 1/2 fill., and we are on a well here. so I know when water is being used because the sound of the pump can be heard everywhere in the house. The sound travels through all the pipes.

And like once we are done using any water, like watching TV in the evening or whatever you never hear the pimp come on again.

And the field is very small, as described earlier. I bet if you were to empty all the pipes it's lucky if it's 20 gallons.