any way to prevent an above ground sump discharge from freezing?


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Old 03-15-23, 05:23 PM
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any way to prevent an above ground sump discharge from freezing?

The subject heading pretty much says it. Spring is wet time in my crawlspace and I'd like to be able to pump while I'm out of town next month. But there is no way to get a buried line in so I either have to unplug it and let her flood or find a way to keep an above ground discharge line from freezing.
 
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Old 03-15-23, 05:58 PM
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Is the temperature in the crawl space above freezing ?
How far do you need to move it ?

Just a quick sketch. If there is no check valve in the crawl space.... the water in the short blue line will drain back onto the pit. The 1-1/2" pipe from the pump dumps into a 3"-4" pvc pipe. If the large pipe freezes the water will discharge out of the 90. The large line outside pitched away from the house will resist freezing.
 
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Old 03-15-23, 06:26 PM
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how cold is it. The drain line should be empty of water except for when the pump is discharging. I suppose if it was cold enough to instantly freeze the flowing water that could be a problem, but if it’s just a few degrees below freezing that shouldn’t happen and the water will flow out before the pipe has a chance to freeze over
 
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Old 03-15-23, 07:54 PM
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I'd like to get it a few feet from the house anyway, otherwise it could just run back in to the crawlspace. I think the diagram could work. There is no check valve. Does that damage the pump though, if the blue line freezes and it backflows? i really don't want that to happen because it will run constantly then.

Outside temps should be well above freezing most days and in the 20s at night but colder spells are possible. The crawlspace is well insulated, so I certainly wouldn't expect it to freeze.
 
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Old 03-15-23, 11:21 PM
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Its all about slope, if you have sufficient slop from the exit point where the water exits the the crawl space it will drain away long before it can freeze.

My Geo Thermal system discharges just like the sketch above/below all winter low, even in sub zero temps and flows freely for 60' to the creek with no issues.
 
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Old 03-16-23, 11:37 AM
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The challenge will be setting something up with 3 feet of snow on the ground. I guess I'd have to shovel out a 10 foot path for the pipe and cobble up some sort of support for the receiving end that will somehow survive shifting from additional snowfall and ground thaw. Not quite sure how though...some kind of bracket attached to the house might work best
 
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Old 03-16-23, 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by worker9999
The challenge will be setting something up with 3 feet of snow on the ground.
Perhaps not. - I've got 3 suggestions for you-

First, if you have a large pipe, simply cover it with a pile of raked-up leaves- they're good insulation and generally, running water won't freeze.

Second, if you are worried about providing an overflow for the sump, you can have the output discharge to a "T" fitting. Example, I've got 2 downspouts that travel under a later-added poured concrete patio. Just-in-case the discharge should freeze over, I've got it discharging into a down-sloping 45° "T" fitting so that if the lower side gets blocked or freezes, it has an 'overflow' drain.
It's hard to see from the picture, but the right side slopes down at a round 10% angle.


Third, if you're worried about ice at the bottom / discharge of the pipe, that's an easy fix.
You'll need one or two 12" square & 2"-3" tall concrete paver(s), a 15 lbs equine/cattle mineral/salt block, and a 5 gallon bucket with a metal handle. Place the paver downstream of the pump output, diamond towards the pipe, so that discharged water flows around the block WITHOUT washing over the top. Set the mineral/salt block on the paver. Bend the curved bucket handle into a rectangle that will fit under the block. Then place the 5 gallon bucket over the salt block, slide the handle under the paver so the bucket doesn't blow away.
You now have an automatic ice-dam-melter. As long as the water flows around the block, the salt stays dry and nothing happens. If the outlet starts to ice over, the ice dam will rise up and touch the salt block, creating bring that melts the ice dam.
(My old office was a converted 7-11 store, with 2 roof valleys that funneled water onto the flat tar rooves on either side. Since the flat rooves were unheated, it always developed ice dams. This paver + salt-block + bucket ice-dam remover works REALLY well...)
 

Last edited by Hal_S; 03-16-23 at 12:28 PM.
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Old 03-16-23, 04:35 PM
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If I have the T, it seems like I wouldn't have to worry about the end of the discharge pipe
 
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Old 03-16-23, 06:38 PM
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You could add some heat tape to the inside of the pipe.
 
 

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